Health Committee on Dec. 4th, 2012

[Dr. Warren Chan]

For nano, I think the first thing I would do is actually build capacity within the universities for young researchers who are working with nanotechnology. There were programs from NSERC and CIHR, and what ended up happening was that people were just modifying their research to fit the nano space when they were not really nanotechnology researchers on a global scale.

The first thing is, how do you get the universities to bring in smart people who are in this area? I'm not from Canada, but I was brought in. I was one of the first ones working on nano with biology, on nano with medicine. How do you bring these people into Canada?

The next thing is to develop a strategy, build centres, and build infrastructures. There are enough infrastructures from CFI grants, but we don't have enough smart people in that particular space at this point compared to other countries. Everyone is competing right now: Singapore, South Korea, and the U.S. The next capacity is actually how to get them funding to allow them to compete.

I think that's the first thing that needs to be done: building people, getting the right people in place who can compete globally. In my opinion, right now we don't have that in the nanomedicine space. We have people who dabble in it, with a few experts, but if you look at capacity compared to Singapore, we don't have the capacity at this point.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Dr. Voyer.

[Dr. Normand Voyer]

I think Canada has been pretty successful in the genomic area by building capacities, by linking people together, and I think our colleagues can comment on that.

With Genome Canada, what we need is some sort of a “Genome Canada-Nanomedicine Canada” that will bring together scientists. In regard to nanotechnology and nanomedicine, it's a multidisciplinary research area. It's very complex.

[A voice]

That's right.

[Dr. Normand Voyer]

We need engineers, chemists, biologists, and medical doctors to work together. We need a network of scientists to work together. We can create that with a national facility—

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Dr. Plummer.

[Dr. Normand Voyer]

—of programs—

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

I'm sorry, Dr. Voyer.

Dr. Plummer.

[Dr. Frank Plummer]

I will just say that I was going to reinforce that point. Genome Canada has been very successful in building genomic capacity, and it may be a strategy that could be looked at for—

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Maybe the two gentlemen in B.C. want to respond as well?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Mr. Easter, Dr. Huntsman wanted to comment on your last question. Is that okay?

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Yes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Dr. Huntsman, please go ahead.

[Dr. David Huntsman]

I think in Canada it's not just about having the best health care, but it's about having the best health care equitably delivered. It has to be equitable within provinces as much as possible, and between provinces as well. In terms of drug approval, Health Canada controls that process. I would think of calling brainstorming sessions with Health Canada and the drug approval teams within Health Canada to start looking at this particular issue, because it is going to take some outside-the-box solutions. But there are people who are working on ideas and they will be well known to the decision-makers within Health Canada.

If we can move forward with this, then Canada will be in the vanguard of more individualized approaches to cancer and other treatments. If we can't, then we will fall behind, which would be very tragic considering that a lot of the base data, which we use to make that move, would have come from Canadian researchers and Canadian government investments.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Dr. Easter—you have been promoted. Mr. Easter, you now have one more minute.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Is enough being done in terms of especially national, but also in this area international, coordination to be successful? I think that Genome Canada is one that has worked really well, but do you go to that model with nano? Somebody has to show the leadership to get us there, I guess that is what I am trying to say.

Is that what's required to find a way of tying all the components together nationally under federal leadership, including the research sector, university sector, etc.?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Who would like to answer?

Dr. Chan.

[Dr. Warren Chan]

I think there needs to be a clear link with the international community in terms of nano-medicine and nano bioresearch in that sector.

We collaborate with people in the U.S., and right now I am debating about helping to set up a joint program between Toronto and Nanjing University. Those are things that are in discussion.

At the end of the day, there's a lot of talent throughout the world. There's also talent in Canada, but it is a global—

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Thank you, Dr. Chan.

We'll now go to Ms. Block.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Saskatoon—Rosetown—Biggar, SK]

I just want to know, Madam Chair, if the witnesses who are joining us by video are leaving right now? I know we keep asking for a couple more minutes, but can you just confirm if they are staying?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Do you have to leave, or are you available for another couple of questions, Doctors?

Okay, Ms. Block, go ahead.

[Dr. David Huntsman]

I think Marco was waving goodbye, and I can't stay for more questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Oh, goodbye Marco. We're holding you hostage, Doctor. Thank you so very much.

Dr. Plummer, I know time has passed for you as well. Dr. Plummer, Dr. Marra, Dr. Huntsman, thank you so much for being with us today and for your very helpful and insightful comments.

We do say goodbye to you, and we'll go on to our next question, Ms. Block.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Saskatoon—Rosetown—Biggar, SK]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I must admit that a few of my questions were for the witnesses who are leaving. But I do also want to echo the comments of many of my colleagues around the table today in regard to the information that we've received. It is incredible to think about all of the research that is going on in this area and the limited understanding that we have around this table.

I do want to pick up on some comments that were made with respect to this technology. I just wrote down some comments: these things are happening very quickly, society isn't ready, we're on the precipice. And I guess I just want to give those witnesses who are with us an opportunity to expand on any concerns you may have about the pace that this technology is happening at and what we need to do to be getting ready as a society and as a government in terms of regulatory framework.

I'll turn it over to both of you to answer that question.

[Dr. Warren Chan]

Coming from the nano perspective, the challenge right now is that the different agencies don't know how to regulate it. Do you regulate it as a drug, or do you regulate it as a device? I work with both the U.S. FDA as well as Health Canada and they are trying to figure it out. Right now it's actually considered a special case, based on a case-by-case basis. That's one challenge.

The second challenge is information. We're developing ways to detect genomics. Is it too much information? There are ethics associated with it. We know that somebody has certain genetic predispositions. Especially when you're using a point-of-care device, how does that affect the person who is actually doing the analysis? Facebook and social media have changed the way we look at communication, so technology is improving the way we are communicating. If you can look in your own iPhone and find out that you have a genetic predisposition for genetics A, B, C, and D, what are you going to do with that information? That's what we're left with at this point.

It's an ethical issue from that perspective.