Evidence of meeting #1 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
Are we okay with what we've suggested? Okay.
(Motion agreed to) [See Minutes of Proceedings]
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
I would like to add another routine motion, which is on notice of motions: that 48 hours' notice be required for any substantive motion to be considered by the committee, unless the substantive motion relates directly to business then under consideration, and that the notice of motion be filed with the clerk in both official languages and distributed and so on and so forth.
I think that's the standard operating procedure or routine motion that most other standing committees use, that 48 hours' notice be given for motions. I just didn't see it here.
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
Yes, I was looking for it too.
We have a master copy here. It reads:
That forty-eight (48) hours' notice be required for any substantive motion to be considered by the Committee, unless the substantive motion relates directly to business then under consideration; and that the notice of motion be filed with the Clerk of the Committee and distributed to the members in both official languages; and that 48 hours' notice be calculated in the same manner as for the House.
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
Yes, we had it here in these principal routine motions, but since you were working back and forth between the two sheets I just want to make sure that we don't miss one.
11:20 a.m.
NDP
Chris Charlton NDP Hamilton Mountain, ON
I have a question. To my knowledge, it's actually not routine among other committees. I'm just wondering what the rationale is for this.
11:20 a.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
Well, Chris, at least for all the committees I've sat on--and I haven't sat on all of them, obviously--it has been the routine that we have 48 hours' notice. I just think it's a good way to proceed, if you're going to have a motion to discuss at this committee, to have notice given, so that all committee members have an opportunity to prepare for the motion under discussion.
11:20 a.m.
NDP
Joe Comartin NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Mr. Lukiwski is certainly correct. In the vast majority of committees that I've been on, the 48 hours' notice for motions is standard.
But this committee is different. I guess I'm speaking a bit out of turn, because I haven't sat on the committee, but certainly my perspective on this committee and my perception of it over the years has been that just because of the very nature of the types of matters that come before us--matters of a substantive nature--they oftentimes do come in at the last minute. If we have to give the 48 hours' notice, on those issues that need to be dealt with rapidly by everybody--seeing as it's necessary to deal with them rapidly--we're going to have to wait.
I understand that we can suspend the rule by majority vote at any time, but I'm just going to suggest that rather than start this way, why don't we go back to our regular practice--the committee's regular practice--of not having this? Then, if it's not working out, we can bring this rule forward at that point. I'll pledge on our part that we'll support it if there are reasons for doing so. I just don't see any reason for doing it at this point.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
Scott Reid Conservative Lanark—Frontenac—Lennox and Addington, ON
In response to that, Joe, just looking at it from the point of view of the equality of the parties, our party, having the majority here, could actually push anything on the committee anyway in the absence of this rule, so that should provide some protection for the opposition. We could stop anything because of a unanimous consent requirement; anybody could stop it coming forward.
We all have the ability to stop something that's not based on some kind of consensus under the 48-hour rule from hijacking the committee, whereas in practice, one party only, if we have the no-notice rule, can dictate what gets put in and what supplants the normal course of action that has been agreed to.
As a practical matter, the other thing in my experience of being on this committee now for a number of years is that when we have something coming before us unexpectedly, it's not normally initiated by us; it's actually the Speaker saying “I'm referring this to the committee”--matters of privilege and that sort of thing. So you don't need to have someone introducing it from here to accomplish that.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
Is there further comment on this addition to this motion?
Seeing none, are all in favour of it as I've read it, including that the 48-hour notice be in there and calculated the same way as it is in the House?
(Motion agreed to) [See Minutes of Proceedings]
Mr. Reid.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
Scott Reid Conservative Lanark—Frontenac—Lennox and Addington, ON
Just to confirm, the 48 hours will be calculated in what fashion? I think it's important that people--
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Joe Preston
In the same manner as in the House: I call it the two-sleep rule, so when two days pass. That's not a strict 48 hours. If a motion came forward to the House even this afternoon, by the time we meet next, two days from this afternoon, you could have it at eleven in the morning. It's not a strict 48 hours. It's that we've gone to sleep twice--or at least most of us have.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
Scott Reid Conservative Lanark—Frontenac—Lennox and Addington, ON
Just with that in mind, I have one further question.
Our clerk served at one point in a subcommittee I chaired and we sometimes would get motions right when the clerk was leaving. This is an important question.
As a practical matter for our clerk, when are you not going to see these things any more? There's a certain point at which we can't submit these things without requiring that you stay here until midnight. What would be a reasonable hour?
June 9th, 2011 / 11:25 a.m.
The Clerk
That would be at the discretion of the committee.
One of the reasons why the text in bold was added--that 48 hours' notice be calculated in the same manner as for the House--is to reinforce the idea of it not being 48 hours in the pure sense of hours, but rather in the sense of two days.
That being said, you are correct, Mr. Reid, in that there are times during the 24-hour day that I'm not checking my BlackBerry--
11:25 a.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
11:25 a.m.
The Clerk
--so there is a practical issue of when the notices come in. It is up to the committee to decide what time, if they would like to put a further amendment to this routine motion stating a time this could be in by.
The only thing I would say to members is that in the House from Monday to Thursday, it's at 6 p.m. and on Fridays at 2 p.m. Also, of course, if the clerk's office is responsible for translation of motions and distribution, there is some delay there. Other than that, it's at the will of the committee to determine a time, if they so wish to stipulate the time on this motion.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
If for no other reason than discussion, I'd recommend 4 p.m.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
I was kind of hoping we would get a nod from the clerk as well.
11:25 a.m.
Conservative
11:25 a.m.
NDP
Chris Charlton NDP Hamilton Mountain, ON
My first preference would be to leave it as is and to leave it as open-ended as possible.
If that is not the desire of the committee, I'm not sure why we would move to 4 o'clock when the House deadline is 6 o'clock.