Evidence of meeting #9 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was formula.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:15 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Yes, provided it remains in October 2015, the fixed date.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
Let me ask you for an overall assessment of the legislation brought forward. I won't get into asking you your opinion of the political aspects of it, as some in this committee tried to raise, but merely the fact that we, in an attempt to try to get better representation by population, have brought this bill forward. In your capacity as Chief Electoral Officer, beyond what you have stated in your presentation to us today, do you see any potential roadblocks or hurdles, perhaps unanticipated or unintended consequences of this bill, that might be problematic for your office?
12:15 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
No. We are confident that we and the commissions will be able to proceed and implement the new formula and the remainder of provisions of the legislation without too much difficulty, provided it's enacted in time.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Tom Lukiwski Conservative Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK
I want to home in on something I know will be an issue with all MPs, particularly in the four provinces affected, where new boundaries have to be drawn and perhaps new names found for the new ridings. You mentioned in your presentation that MPs would have an ability, if they have objections to some of the proposed boundaries by the individual provincial electoral commissions, to have an opportunity to, in effect, appeal them. Could you give us a bit more detail on that?
12:15 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
MPs will have two opportunities to make their views known around the proposed new delimitations, first at the public hearings that must be held by commissions across the country in each of the provinces, and secondly when the initial report of the commissions is provided to the House. The Speaker will refer them, in my understanding, to this committee. The committee will receive the objections of colleagues regarding any issue arising from the proposed new boundaries, and the committee will report their views on these objections. The commissions, in due course, will be required to consider those views. Of course, they are not bound, but they will have to consider the objections that will be relayed by this committee.
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
12:20 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I may have a moment or two left, and I'll give them to Mr. Comartin. That's not likely, with the way I go on, but I'll do my best.
Thank you very much. It's good to see you again. I've done a lot of work with you--a lot of files--and one more today. We're interested in the timeframes, and you focused on that. Mr. Lukiwski was strategic enough to raise that in his opening questions. Fair enough. The government has said it must have this bill done by the end of this year in order to do all the things that are necessary. Of course, the competing pressure is that we want to make sure that every province and territory that wants an opportunity to speak to this committee and this bill should be given that opportunity. There are a lot of experts we want to bring in. It's a complicated formula, so we're hoping to have enough time to do our work.
I noted that in responding to Mr. Lukiwski you said that having this passed within the five weeks the government has stipulated would be the best scenario. But those words don't necessarily mean that if it's not done, the new seats can't be in place. I know you can't comment on a political date versus a real-world date, which is where I'm going, but I'll frame it to you this way: what, in your opinion, would be the drop-dead date, the absolute latest, that you feel this bill has to be out of the House of Commons?
12:20 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
The best date, in our mind, would be before the commissions are set up in February. Otherwise, commissions will have to start their work, the legislation will come into place later on, and they will have to restart again. That may, of course, generate additional costs, but also quite a bit of confusion, depending on what time the legislation comes into place.
Again, the transitional provisions that are in the bill provide a variety of scenarios. The commissions' work has to be completed at least seven months before the next election date, otherwise the new boundaries won't apply.
12:20 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
Okay.
Just so you know, we have indicated that it's our desire as the official opposition to do everything we can to ensure, regardless of how we feel about the bill, that it's in place in time, because that's an overarching priority.
What I'm seeking to know from you, given the deadlines you're using, sir, is if, hypothetically, we took part of January, when the House isn't sitting, to meet and do committee work and pass this on the first day we return--which would mean it would be out before the February census is released--it would still meet your needs.
12:20 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Provided that it also goes through the Senate before the census is released.
12:20 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
Okay. I'm talking about the elected part of our government; the rest of it is just pro forma.
Let me reiterate. If it passes the House, notwithstanding time and whatever at the Senate, as long as it's in your hands in early February,by the time the census numbers are released--I believe it's February 8 or 12--that would be okay, that would still meet your needs? Then what happens back in December or January is up to us.
12:20 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
The new formula will apply only after royal assent is given. Until the royal assent is provided, the commission has to work with the current formula.
12:20 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
Understood.
Given the fact that the Senate is appointed and the guy who appointed them controls what they do, the Senate part shouldn't be a problem. What really matters is what the elected people think. I hear your point. I accept that and respect it. I'm just trying to make the case that should there be room needed to hear from the Premier of Saskatchewan or his designate, we want to make sure the time is there. It would be wrong to not have whatever seats are going to be in place for the next election, but it would be equally wrong if that was done when there are provinces and territories that wanted an opportunity to have a say but they didn't.
Do you have any comment on that?
12:25 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
That's a matter for the committee to consider.
12:25 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
All right. I respect that. Thank you.
I pass it over to my colleague, Chair.
12:25 p.m.
NDP
Joe Comartin NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Assuming for a minute that Bill C-20 wasn't before you as a law, under the existing procedure, how long would it take for it to be completed?
12:25 p.m.
Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Under the existing procedure, currently it would bring us to around the spring of 2013.
12:25 p.m.
NDP
Joe Comartin NDP Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
So we've got a substantial gap.
Mr. Mayrand, if we simply had a quick amendment to the existing legislation that postponed the timeline requirements you've got, we'd have a lot of time where we can still be ready to implement this and the existing procedure?
