Evidence of meeting #41 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was c-50.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Then you would agree with me that this legislation, Bill C-50, is not an instruction; it just gives the ability for an instruction to occur. That's what we're talking about.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
We're not talking about a specific instruction; it's the ability to issue an instruction.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
So when the minister says there will be consultation with the provinces and stakeholders before an instruction issues, do you not accept that or believe that?
11:55 a.m.
Treasurer, Canadian Bar Association
It's not a question of belief. I would rather see it in the law, because the minister has the authority to say, “I don't want to hear from you”, just like the way this came out.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
Thank you.
That about completes it.
Thank you very much for coming today, Mr. Green and Ms. Froc. As you know, we'll be doing a report, and hopefully some of the recommendations you made will be contained in it.
I want to mention something about the way we do questioning here. We haven't talked about it in quite some time, but it has been straightened out.
I think the problem, Andrew, was that you were looking at the individual, but it specifically says “the party”. The witnesses are to be given ten minutes, sometimes seven, and during the questioning there will be allocated seven minutes for the first questioner of each party and thereafter five minutes will be allocated to each questioner who has not yet had a chance to participate, in the following order. And that's the order.
I went over to Nina, for instance, and she had not yet participated, but she was free to hand her five minutes over to Ed if she wanted to.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
Yes, but it says here that, “thereafter five minutes be allocated to each questioner who has not yet had a chance to participate”, and it lays out the order. After that the schedule will repeat with a five-minute time limit for each round. That's where it should end. What you have said is totally converse to what was said in the previous section.
I know we had big debates about this previously, and it was always to make sure that everybody had a chance to get in a round of questions.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
That's if the person wants to. If I go to an individual who says, “This is my time slot and I haven't yet participated, so I'm passing my time slot”...that's why it says “party”.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
No, it says that in the beginning. But then it says, “there be allocated seven minutes for the first questioner of each party and that thereafter five minutes be allocated to each questioner who has not yet had a chance to participate, in the following order”. That means everybody who hasn't spoken gets a chance to speak.
It gets difficult where it says, “and that no individual member be allowed to participate more than once in each round”.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
This was done specifically because we didn't want to get into a situation where the parliamentary secretary did all the questioning and talking, and then--
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
But on your side, if Maurizio didn't want to participate and he said, “Andrew is the expert on this and I must give this to Andrew”, he could pass that over to you half a dozen times if he wanted to. That's done all the time.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
No. I'm saying that everybody has to get a chance to dip in on it, and then you start a new round.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
That's if they want to, yes. That's the way we've been doing it. It's the party.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
Yes, but after “the party”, it says “each individual”. It doesn't say, “party”, any more. It's only in the first round.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
It says, “that no individual member be allowed to participate more than once”.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
But it says, “seven minutes for the first questioner of each party and thereafter five minutes be allocated to each questioner”.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
That's each questioner who has not yet had a chance to participate. It's each questioner within the party, I suppose.
Noon
Liberal
Andrew Telegdi Liberal Kitchener—Waterloo, ON
We reduced it to “each questioner”. So those who haven't asked questions can ask questions, and you don't have somebody asking two questions before everybody has had a chance to ask a question. That's what it is about. That's what it says. Take a look and read it. That's the purpose behind it.
Noon
Bloc
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
Mr. Chairman, I think the problem results from the fact that this article does not clearly state that every member of the Committee must take a turn. The rules don't talk about cases where a Committee member transfers his or her time to a colleague. What distorts the intent of this clause is that every person can have an opportunity to speak. In order for there to be a better, more democratic discussion, I think it would be appropriate for each member to have an opportunity to speak, so that the Parliamentary Secretary is not forcing a colleague to give him his or her speaking time.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
We've dealt with this a half a dozen times. Apparently people are not interested in dealing with it any further because everyone has left.
We'll try to get everyone on--let's put it that way.
The meeting is adjourned.