Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Feb. 10th, 2009

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Okay, fine.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Shory.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Minister, in your opening remarks—

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

There's a point of order.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

We are starting a second round, am I correct?

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

No, we're still on the third round, and Mr. Shory is the last speaker in the third round.

Mr. Shory.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Thank you once again, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

I'm sorry to interrupt you, but could we stop the clock for a minute?

You all know that we agreed to go until a quarter to eleven, and I know there are still some speakers over here. I know that I have to leave here at 11 o'clock, so if we are going to extend the meeting, someone else is going to have to chair it. It's up to the committee.

Mr. Shory is the last in the third round.

Mr. Shory.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Minister, in your opening remarks you mentioned the foreign credentials programs. In our 2004 Conservative platform, we undertook to address the issue of recognizing foreign credentials and skills in Canada. Then, upon forming government, we acted on our platform promises and have actually boosted the number of foreign credentialled offices and officers here in Canada and abroad as well.

Minister, could you inform the committee how this strategy is working, and the result of our additional focus and investment? Further, how do you expect this strategy will work in the future?

I also note, Minister, that Budget 2009 provides $50 million to support this program. Can you please tell the committee what the focus will be of that $50 million in spending?

Thank you.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

First of all, the government in the last Parliament created the Foreign Credentials Referral Office through the Ministry of Human Resources and Social Development, with, I believe, a $32 million fiscal commitment. The focus of that office was to provide information to newcomers on credential recognition. Among other things, they have created the Working in Canada web portal, which essentially allows one-stop shopping, either through the web portal or in person at 320 Service Canada centres across Canada and a number of our missions abroad.

This allows prospective immigrants, or those who have been selected for permanent residency in Canada, to get one-stop shopping and coherent information on how they can get their credentials recognized. They can now see, by linking to different professional agencies across the country, which provinces have the most progressive professional associations in their own particular occupations, for purposes of credential recognition. We hope that now that they can begin the process abroad, they won't arrive in Canada and struggle through the red tape, spending their first two or three years stuck in survival jobs trying to figure out how to make applications.

We hope that with the information we're providing them through the FCRO, and now with the expanded $50 million in funding for the national credential recognition framework, they will be able to start their application process, obtain supplementary documents if they're necessary, or even get additional education or take additional courses while they're awaiting a pending immigration decision to Canada. We think this will help people.

We're also funding, through the Association of Canadian Community Colleges, a program called the Canadian Immigration Integration Project, which has three pilot offices abroad, one in Manila, one in Guangzhou in China, and one in New Delhi, which are offering tailor-made, free consulting to people selected for permanent residency in Canada on all issues of integration, but with a focus on credential recognition.

I met with some of these people in New Delhi who had already obtained job offers in Canada and a headstart on credential recognition, because of the two-day seminar we were offering and other assistance.

Finally, the Prime Minister made a platform commitment in the last election to put this important issue on the agenda of the first ministers meeting. He did that on January 16 and secured for the first time an agreement by the first ministers to create a national framework for credential recognition by the end of this year. The $50 million commitment in this budget will help to finance the development of that framework, largely under the leadership of my colleague, Minister Finley, at HRSDC. Of course, that work is going to be assisted by the agreement of the first ministers to create a domestic, open labour market in Canada. One of the problems is that it doesn't matter whether you're coming from abroad or not, but that we still have problems in terms of labour market mobility in Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're past the time, but we'll give Mr. Calandra a minute and Mr. Bevilacqua a minute. Please be brief.

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Oak Ridges—Markham, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Minister, really briefly, I just wondered if you could comment on how closely we work with the provinces and territories to determine the priorities in the experience class.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

In the Canadian experience class, it's very closely--I'm sorry, which class do you mean?

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Oak Ridges—Markham, ON]

I mean in the experience class.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

In terms of the 38 prioritized occupations, we had a lengthy process of consultations with stakeholders, particularly with the provincial and territorial governments. These consultations were conducted in the spring and summer of last year.

Some of the provinces and territories said, “Look, this list isn't long enough. We have labour market needs that aren't reflected on the list of 38.” But we had to come up with a list that was rational, that was reflective of national labour market needs and priorities. That's what we did. The list is published on our website and published in the Canada Gazette. I pointed out to our provincial colleagues that if they have particular regional labour market needs, they can pursue provincial nominee programs to attract immigrants to respond to those regional needs.

Finally, we remain open to modifying the list as we go forward. We're not dogmatic about this. We want a system that works well for immigrants and for our economy, that reduces the backlog and gets people here more quickly.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Bevilacqua.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I'll be quick because I know you are concerned about timing. We spend a lot of time in this committee, because we're dealing with estimates, talking about issues like processing times. I'm referring to the issues of the backlog and temporary foreign workers, and you've gone through all sorts of programs like foreign credentials and refugees.

For us as parliamentarians and people who assume a certain leadership role in our country, the bottom line is that once all this is done, immigrants come to Canada and they're not doing as well as they should be, and therefore we are not maximizing the human resources potential of our country. Immigrants who come today have a tougher time than those who came after the war, for example. That's a major concern as it relates to integration, but it's also a major concern as it relates to the issue of nation building. These big broader issues require a lot more attention by this government.

I can tell you I was very concerned about the fact that in the last Speech from the Throne, brief as it may have been, the word “immigration” didn't even appear. I think it's the same story with the previous Speech from the Throne. While this government claims to understand, comprehend, and do all these things for immigration and immigrants, I really believe that the rhetoric does not match the action. Nor does a Speech from the Throne that lacks the word “immigration” in any way, shape, or form signal to new Canadians that in fact it's a serious concern of this government.

Minister, I sat around the cabinet table, and I will give my two cents' worth to you here.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

I hope it's short.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

You have to fight for greater space on the national agenda and you have to fight for greater resources for new Canadians, because I think that new Canadians are cluing into the fact that the speeches that Canada's political class deliver at many of their functions and events are actually not realized in true terms when it comes to budgetary items and when it comes to priority-setting issues in our country.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Bevilacqua. I appreciate your long-standing passion for immigration, a passion I share.

I think it's perhaps a little unfair to critique the last Speech from the Throne in that respect since it was really an update of the previous Speech from the Throne. It was strictly focused on our economic challenges. The previous Speech from the Throne did speak to immigration. It spoke to the platform commitment to, amongst other things, raise the issue of credential recognition with the first ministers.

I would point out that this is the first time a Prime Minister has put that issue squarely on the agenda with his provincial counterparts and has gotten a national commitment for action. We're all frustrated to know that our constituents are struggling to work in their chosen profession. That's a problem that has affected both federal and provincial politicians from all parties and all levels of governments for a long time now, but I think we are making progress. I think the Prime Minister deserves some credit, even in a non-partisan sense, for putting this squarely on the national agenda and getting the premiers to respond, and for putting our money where our mouth is, for adding $50 million in this budget to $32 million previously budgeted. That was not done before.

I don't accept that this government has not focused on immigration. The reality is that we have maintained historic high levels of intake. As I mentioned last year, they are the largest in history in terms of people who are either permanent residents or who might become permanent residents.

I just announced today that our government has seen a fourfold increase, or is planning a fourfold increase, just as one example, in the number of refugees eligible to come from the Middle East.

We have taken action on credential recognition.

We have increased settlement funding by $1.4 billion, or 219%, since the previous government was in place.

For the first time in a generation we have begun to see a reduction rather than an increase in the inventory of skilled foreign workers.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're running out of time, Mr. Minister.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

I think we're actually making progress. It's not perfect, but we're making progress.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay. I know we'd like to go on, but the committee has some business to do.

Mr. Minister, Mr. Karygiannis has a point of privilege, which I think may involve you, so we'll wait anxiously for his point of privilege.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

While in the first round of questioning, I brought up some figures and the minister went on to say something along the lines that he doubted my figures, that the figures we had given the previous committee were certainly figures that did not make any sense--

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Dykstra, do you have a point of order? We're in the middle of a point of privilege here.