Evidence of meeting #21 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was students.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Roberta Jamieson  President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation
Paulette Tremblay  Director, Post-Secondary Education, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation
Michael Mendelson  Policy Analyst, Caledon Institute of Social Policy

9:10 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

I call to order the Standing Committee on Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development for Tuesday, October 24, 2006.

Committee, before we go into the orders of the day I wish to report on a few items. The first one is of course that we will not be having a meeting on Thursday of this week.

Secondly, I have met with the clerk and the research staff, Madam Hurley. We talked somewhat about possible witnesses in the future, when we're dealing with Bill C-292. Madam Hurley has put together a list of a few suggestions, and we are circulating it.

It Is not “the” list, just some suggestions put forward, without any influence by any political person. You are welcome to add to the list, and a memo has been sent out to each committee member. Please forward information to the clerk. I will be discussing this at the Tuesday meeting for 15 minutes.

On Tuesday we're going to deal with the presentation from Mr. GooGoo from 9 o'clock until 9:45; then we're going to take 15 minutes to talk about the list of possible witnesses for Bill C-292, and I will make sure it's only 15 minutes. Then we're going to deal with Madam Neville's motion from 10 o'clock to 11. Is that okay?

[Technical difficulty--Editor]

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

Steven Blaney Conservative Lévis—Bellechasse, QC

What is suggested at this time for the members is a departure on Wednesday afternoon or evening, depending, and a return on Thursday afternoon as well. So everybody will be here around six on Thursday evening; that's for sure.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Anita Neville Liberal Winnipeg South Centre, MB

Is that a direct flight?

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

Steven Blaney Conservative Lévis—Bellechasse, QC

It's a direct flight from Gatineau to Roberval. It's a direct flight of about an hour and 15 minutes.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Nancy Karetak-Lindell Liberal Nunavut, NU

To where the conference is? That's what we were trying to find out.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

Steven Blaney Conservative Lévis—Bellechasse, QC

Yes. There might be some lack of communication.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

Maybe I could ask the parliamentary secretary.

Mr. Bruinooge, could you make sure that the minister's office makes certain that the person in charge of arranging this trip contacts all the members to make sure they're aware of what their needs are?

Just before we move on and get started here, we'll go to Mr. Lemay.

9:15 a.m.

Bloc

Marc Lemay Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC

I'd like to raise two points.

First, with respect to the First Nations Socio-Economic Forum, we clearly can't leave before the vote in the House. There will be a very important vote on Wednesday. If my colleagues opposite want to leave, that won't bother me too much. However, we clearly can't leave before the vote is held. In addition, we've planned that Mr. Gilles Duceppe, Mr. Michel Gauthier, my assistant and myself will take a chartered flight at 7:00 p.m., after the 5:45 p.m. vote.

Second, as regards Bill C-292, An Act to implement the Kelowna Accord, I wonder whether a meeting of the subcommittee or committee members should be convened to discuss the witnesses we want to hear. I'm not sure that 15 minutes will be enough to discuss that.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

I will move on, but Mr. Lemay, yes, I am only going to look for direction from the committee on whether they want the subcommittee to deal with the list of witnesses or want to do it as a committee of the whole in a subsequent meeting. We can make time for that, if you want to spend a half hour as a group looking through the witness list. If that's the direction the committee gives me, then we'll do it. If the committee's pleasure is that it be referred to the subcommittee, then we'll do that. That's the only thing we'll be dealing with in that 15 minutes.

Okay? We'll move on.

Thank you for your patience, witnesses. Today we have with us Roberta Jamieson, the president and chief executive officer of the National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation, and Paulette Tremblay, director of post-secondary education.

Welcome, and thank you for being here today. We are going to allow you to have a ten-minute presentation, and then we'll follow with questions from the committee. Thank you.

9:15 a.m.

Roberta Jamieson President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Sekoh. Skano. Bonjour. Good morning.

As you've mentioned, I'm here this morning on behalf of the National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation, which focuses on the educational opportunities of first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth.

I've been around this place long enough to know about the crushing burdens that you carry as members—your constituency demands, caucus demands, people who ask for your time, the business of the House, and something called a personal life. It would be so natural, so easy, to regard this as one more meeting of one more committee studying one more problem to be resolved, and on to the next. However, I hope I can persuade you and empower you to really take up the importance of today's subject, as I know you will. I ask that you grasp it firmly and not let it go until you've seen results from your committed efforts to create change.

Two decades ago I spent more than a year as an ex-officio member of this committee. I saw what could happen when committee members focused on a critical subject and reached consensus across party lines. Instead of bringing other views to the committee, they took the committee's recommendations back to caucus. With a report that has come to be called the Penner report, we achieved unanimous acceptance by all parties represented in the House, with that approach. My hope is that this committee will do the same as you focus on post-secondary education.

That's my constant preoccupation as CEO of the foundation: education, or enabling our youth the realize their potential. Implicit in education is the realization of human potential. The lack of this realization for first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth is truly one of Canada's greatest failings.

We don't need today to study the depth of the problem or the width of the gap that history has handed to this generation. I'm not going to overwhelm you today with a massive presentation on statistics, because we know that all the comparisons I could show you are shocking. We know that almost half of our young people are without even high school, compared to 31% of Canadians. We know that if we had the same percentage of university graduates as is present in the Canadian population, there would now be 72,000 more aboriginal graduates than we now have. That's the shortfall. For Inuit people, it is in fact a shortfall of 3,600 university graduates in order to have the same ratio as Canadians.

While the causes for me are obvious and sufficiently well known, perhaps not so obvious are the benefits to be gained from true investment, action, and partnerships. I was happy to see, on September 28 at Queen's University, Finance Minister Jim Flaherty speaking of post-secondary education as “one of the cornerstones of our success as a nation” for Canada. He talked about the need for providing, I quote, “predictable long-term funding for post-secondary education”.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

Can I interrupt you for one minute?

Mr. Lévesque, do you have a problem?

9:20 a.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Chair, would it be possible to get copies of the documents in French? Right now, there's only one copy in English.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

I don't know. Is there only one in...?

9:20 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Roberta Jamieson

There is no document.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

There is no document available in English or French. This is an oral presentation.

9:20 a.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

I saw documents and I thought they were related to Ms. Jamieson's presentation.

9:20 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Roberta Jamieson

Do you want me to slow down? Would that be helpful?

9:20 a.m.

Bloc

Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

No, that's fine.

It might be good to slow down a bit to enable the interpreters to do their work properly.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

Thank you.

9:20 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Roberta Jamieson

So he talked about the need for providing “predictable long-term funding for post-secondary education” to “train our future researchers, scientists and innovators”. He also noted the severe shortage of skilled labour, the need for better cooperation between governments, and the need to eliminate barriers to higher education. These remarks about the importance of post-secondary education for Canada's future are equally important for the future of first nations, Métis, and Inuit peoples, if not more so.

Although the task is certainly daunting—and it is daunting—to address this, we must do what we can do in our time, in our generation. It can be this committee's heritage and its niche in history to put this into motion.

I can tell you from my experience as a student on reserve from grade one through high school, as a parent of a student in the same system, as the elected chief of the same community, as a passionate advocate of change for our situation in Canada, and now as president and CEO at the foundation, that conversion of potential to success to achievement won't just happen. It requires commitment, hard work, and a spirit that just won't give up. It also requires that we work together, and I'm hoping the committee sees the foundation I represent as a powerful ingredient in realizing the changes you would like to see.

The bold mandate that we have is to encourage, empower, inspire, and provide assistance so that first nations, Métis, and Inuit youths can convert their tremendous potential, their aspirations, and their dreams into solid achievement and brighter futures. We make it possible for them to contribute their gifts to their communities, to Canada, and to the world.

What is our core focus? Providing scholarships for our youths so that they can continue their education. We provide scholarships in a variety of fields: post-secondary education, health careers, fine arts, and also for cultural projects. We bring together public-sector—that is to say, government—and private-sector resources, and we carefully invest those resources to achieve a maximum of tangible and intangible results.

The foundation is a registered national charity, and the only one in Canada that provides educational support for first nations, Métis, and Inuit youths. We receive money from corporate donors, from first nations and our organizations, and from federal and provincial governments, and we often use resources from one sector to leverage funds from the other sector. We also proudly administer more than $14 million in endowments and trusts, for which our youths are the beneficiaries. Outside the federal government, we're the largest supporter of education for first nations, Métis, and Inuit youths.

Since 1988, the foundation has awarded $23.5 million in grants. To give you a sense of the numbers that we work with, I'm just going to take last year, 2005-06. We received 1,129 applications and made awards to 83% of the applicants—that is to say, to 934 recipients. Of these recipients, 53% were in post-secondary education, such as social science, education, business, law, science, technical studies, and engineering; 29% per cent were in health career fields; 18% were in fine arts or cultural projects. Of those, 35 engineers received assistance, 39 lawyers, 87 in science, 19 in technical studies, and I could go on. That's the good side.

Last year more than $2.8 million were awarded, up from $1.9 million the previous year. That's great news. There's a downside, however, and here it is. The support requested was over $8.6 million. We could only meet 32.5% of the amount requested. As well, despite increased education costs over nearly two decades, we are awarding now less per person than we were then.

Because we feel the need to stretch out what we have to assist more students, we take into account in awarding funds to students four criteria. The awards are done by jury. We look at demonstrated financial need and their own contribution to education costs and those of their first nation, if that's available to them. We look at their evidence of their involvement in and contribution to aboriginal community. We look at their evidence of suitability and commitment to their field of study, including requiring letters of reference, and we look at their demonstrated academic performance and merit in awarding these scholarships.

It goes without saying, but I will say so, that if we had had more money, we would have gone after even more applicants, would have responded to the applicants we got, and would have been able to provide basically more assistance to the students. We've monitored and tracked our students and asked them what their barriers are to post-secondary education. And they've told us, frankly, financial assistance.

I believe the foundation is much more than another competitor for the federal dollar. We've demonstrated that we improve the return on investment in education of first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth. We get results for the money. We nurture, support, encourage, and do all the things that investors do to realize return on their investments. We're able to use federal money as leverage to bring in more from the private sector, as I've mentioned, and to mix that with provincial investment and even individuals who support the foundation. We're also fully accountable. We demonstrate outcomes, concrete results for the money spent. I've mentioned what we awarded to 934 recipients last year. By the end of this year, the foundation will have given to more than 6,000 recipients over our life. Since 1999, 30% of our students have been in their final year of study each year, so that tells you they're graduating. We are now tracking even more closely, and I'm happy to speak in the question-and-answer session on our evaluation efforts and what we know and what we don't know.

We also provide transparency, financially. I invite you to have a look at our website--www.naaf.com. You will see our annual reports, our audited statements, and so on. We could do a lot more, with great benefit, if we had more resources.

Why should Canada be interested in providing more resources? On the one hand, Canada's economy is facing frightening labour shortages in almost every field, and we know that. We know that Canada is relying on immigration to keep the economy going, to provide services to an aging population. On the other hand, we know first nations, Métis, and Inuit people nationally are Canada's fastest-growing sector of the population, facing themselves frightening unemployment, under-employment, poverty, and unrealized productivity and potential.

There are two implications from this pair of circumstances. One is that each set of problems provides a solution to the other problem. Instead of two problems, I believe we have two solutions. The other implication is that if Canada relies on immigration to solve its labour problems, without dealing with the employment needs of its fastest-growing demographic sector, and if Canada leaves first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth on the sidelines for another generation, while it recruits internationally for workers, that's a recipe for both tragedy and trouble.

Part of the answer is the foundation. And I'm asking that this committee recommend that the government use the foundation's capabilities to convert problems into solutions. We've been very successful, as I've mentioned, in bringing together public and private sectors to leverage opportunity, to provide for our young people.

But the foundation does even more than that, and takes other lateral approaches in achieving results. We're changing images. We're changing minds. We're demolishing the negative image that currently exists, and the stereotypes, and creating new ways of seeing ourselves and others, showing what happens when our intellectual and creative potential has the opportunity to develop.

We do the annual achievement awards, for which we are well known, televised nationally on Global and APTN. March 16, 2007, Edmonton: please mark your calendars.

That gala provides a double benefit. Not only do Canadians get an education about what first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth--all our people--have to offer, but our people see positive role models. We're inspired, and we believe we have a future to grasp. We hold up our scientists, our healers, our environmentalists, and our peacemakers to show what we can contribute to the world in our own way and within our own identities. In seeking this individual achievement, we also seek it in the name of collective affirmation as indigenous peoples.

We focus a lot on post-secondary education, which is what you are looking at, but let me tell you, we are also working hard at especially the high school level. Too many of our young people are not completing high school. We do so with career fairs. The next one is in Yellowknife on November 25, and then in Halifax on February 1. We bring together young people with role models to motivate, educate, inspire, and help them believe they have a future to grasp.

We also take into the classrooms role models and modules that will show our young people the smorgasbord, the opportunities they have. We have wonderful modules in justice and in health, and in careers in the railway. More modules are in the making, produced in partnership with Canadian corporations and the public sector.

Then there is Rivers to Success. I don't have time to tell you about that program today, although I would love to. We're going to pilot it. We're shaping the pilot for Nunavut. Rivers is about reclaiming kids who've dropped out of high school, bringing them back into the fold, preparing them for trades, for post-secondary education, for university--for whatever their dream is.

Again, it's collaboration that we work on at the foundation. We're not reinventing programs. We're not providing another layer of services. We are maximizing what's there and putting it to the use of our young people.

We work with all those who are willing to help, those who are opting to take charge of our lives, to take ownership of our well-being and our future, and to make ourselves accountable to our children and to their future. That's what I'm doing at the foundation at this point in my life.

We understand that problems won't be dealt with, nor potential liberated, if we just throw enough money at it. We get that. But there is no doubt that we must have our resources to fulfill our mandate.

We know that we are only one instrument in a multi-faceted circumstance, but I tell you, we are a promising one. We are operating at a critical juncture in our history. If our students struggle through their childhood to get to the point where they can go on to advanced training, advanced education, and then find that the resources aren't there for them to move on, the tragedy is so painful we simply cannot allow it to happen. In Canada today, no first nation, Métis, or Inuit young person should be prevented from going on to post-secondary training or education because of lack of financial resources.

I wish the committee strength, health, clarity of vision, and patience in taking leadership on behalf of Canada to ensure that the challenge is met squarely and thoroughly.

We ask the committee to recommend to Parliament that the foundation be used as a means of assuring that every first nation, Inuit, and Métis student accepted for post-secondary studies has the means to realize that dream.

I'm pleased to answer questions, and to be even more concrete in my recommendations. Mr. Chair, thank you for your attention. I look forward to the dialogue with members.

9:35 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

Thank you for the presentation.

I made a commitment to Mr. Mendelson that I would be sharp at 10 o'clock, but I think it would be only fair, because of the 20 minutes we were delayed, to take 10 minutes off each presentation. So we'll go until 10:10 and then Mr. Mendelson will speak.

Madam Neville.

9:40 a.m.

Liberal

Anita Neville Liberal Winnipeg South Centre, MB

Thank you, Ms. Jamieson, for your presentation and your passion.

I'm going to take you up on your offer for more concrete information. I'd like to have further information on the success rates and your longitudinal studies. What have they shown you about the students you've graduated with?

I would also like to follow up on your recommendation at the end, to find out exactly what you're looking for.

9:40 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Roberta Jamieson

First of all, let me say that I'm delighted to be joined here by Dr. Paulette Tremblay, who has not only a doctorate in education but also a masters in evaluation. When I came to the foundation, it was important to me to focus on evaluation and ensure accountability.

The foundation is those days did not have the resources to do this. More recently, we have acquired additional resources to do the kind of tracking and monitoring we think is important. We did tracking for 2005-06 in the health area, and we have a statistical profile of our applicants with respect to gender, aboriginal affiliation, province, residence, scholarships, educational level, barriers they've encountered, supports they need to be successful, how they feel about our service, employment prospects, who they're working with, whether they're working in their field of study, whether they're working in the communities, record of volunteer work, and whether they're working for the government.

I didn't want to sort of throw all that on the table, but we are tracking and monitoring this. We did so last year for health careers. We are doing it this year for all post-secondary fields of study, and I dare say we are the only ones in the country doing this kind of tracking. It's critical to plan.

We are beginning the quantitative tracking. We'd love to have longitudinal studies; they're needed. We simply do not have the resources to do most longitudinal studies. We have some. We have produced some reports, which I'd be happy to provide to you at the chair's request.

9:40 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Colin Mayes

We would like to request a copy of that tracking. If it could be provided to the committee, we could perhaps make reference to it in the final report.

9:40 a.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, National Aboriginal Achievement Foundation

Roberta Jamieson

We would be happy to.

We do the analysis by gender--from 1999 to 2006--in the area of study. By province, we can tell you what funds are going to Métis, first nations, and Inuit over time. So we are tracking.

We need to do more. I am very keen to track, especially at the end. We know that 30% of our students are returning to us. From 1999 to 2006, every year, 30% of our students have been in their final year. They're succeeding. They're graduating. There are high marks. But we need to follow them even beyond that.

To be more concrete about my recommendation, I would like to see a serious allocation of funds to address first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth opportunities in post-secondary education. I don't think it would be too ambitious to look at a two-part allocation of funds: one, a set-aside fund; and two, a pledge to provide additional funds contingent on the private sector stepping up to match the contribution.

I would like to see a $100-million allocation for first nations, Métis, and Inuit youth scholarships and bursaries--not all endowed. You can only award the interest when it's all endowed. I'd like to see some funds endowed and some not. I would also like to see an additional $50 million pledged, provided the private sector matches it. I am fully energized to get those matching dollars.

You may also wish to invite the provincial government into the mix, or you may wish to earmark existing funds that provinces receive. However you want to do that, the politics with the jurisdictions is yours. My worry is that much-needed funds get to our young people.

I think we have an excellent and demonstrated track record at the foundation in managing the funds we've received over time.