Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on March 20th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I'll just jump in here. We are out of time. I'll give the minister time for a brief response.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

I'm going to invite Deputy Minister Valerie Gideon to respond to this question.

[Valerie Gideon, Deputy Minister, Department of Crown-Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs]

Indigenous Services Canada is the organization that provides direct funding to NACCA.

Regional development agencies also play a part. The Economic Development Agency of Canada for the Regions of Quebec, for instance, met with the people at NACCA. I am the president of the Federal Economic Development Agency for Northern Ontario. I would be happy to ask my colleagues and fellow agency presidents about the issues you're raising.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Thank you.

Ms. Ashton, it's now over to you for your six minutes.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you.

My first question is for Minister Anandasangaree.

In the fall economic statement, it became clear that this government is moving away from indigenous peoples being this government's most important relationship, as you mentioned. Not only is this government cutting funding at a time of great need; a number of programs are being sunsetted, including those that deal with the harmful and destructive legacy of residential schools. There's currently no plan to fund this program past 2025, and communities are concerned.

Three years ago, Pimicikamak First Nation here in northern Manitoba was clear that they wanted to work with the International Commission on Missing Persons to help them with the searches of the burial grounds of the residential school on their territory. This contract is slated to end this year.

Why has your department failed to work with Pimicikamak and the ICMP? Are you willing to extend the programming available to Cross Lake at this time?

I will point out that the great irony is that Canada is willing to work with organizations like the ICMP in Ukraine and Iraq but unwilling to support first nations who want to work with them here at home. So much for reconciliation.

I'll go back to my question. What is your plan to support Pimicikamak and their desire to work with ICMP, as others have expressed as well, given that this program is being sunsetted?

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

Thank you for the question, Ms. Ashton.

At the outset, let me just say that the work around unmarked graves is critical to ensuring that there's justice, accountability, closure and the ability for communities to heal.

ICMP was contracted to do some work for the Government of Canada. It is one of several organizations that are able to support communities. There have been a range of views with respect to individual communities being able to access a type of service, which is essentially DNA testing, and additional work around exhumed bodies. ICMP is one of those players in this space. There are others as well that offer that type of service.

Ultimately, what it comes down to—

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

I'm sorry, Minister, but just to be clear—

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

May I respond? Ms. Ashton, if I may just—

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Well, I'd like you to respond in terms of Cross Lake and not about who the other players are. Cross Lake has asked to work with the ICMP, so that's what I'd like to hear about.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON]

Our objective is to ensure that there's self-determination over the type of agency or partner that they want to work with. If Cross Lake wants to work with ICMP, then that is something we will facilitate. There's absolutely no reason we won't be able to do that.

It ultimately comes down to the notion of self-determination. It will be determined on a community-by-community basis, based on the wishes of the community.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you very much.

I want to turn to Minister Vandal on Nutrition North.

In the last fiscal year, the northern affairs department allocated $134 million to Nutrition North. Almost half of that money went to the North West Company, a massive corporation that made $190 million of profit last year. The Nutrition North program is supposed to bring down grocery prices for northerners. Instead, we're seeing it help CEOs.

According to a recent study at U of T Mississauga, only 67¢ of each dollar in grocery subsidies is passed on to consumers. People here in northern Manitoba, in Nunavut and elsewhere are experiencing significant hardship. Nutrition North is not working for them the way it's supposed to, when a family-sized box of cereal costs $17.99 and a litre of olive oil costs $36.59. The list goes on.

Presumably, neither the minister nor anyone else in the government would tolerate paying this price for their own groceries, so why should northerners? What is this government doing to address real food insecurity in the north and also to ensure that Nutrition North funds are not going to line the pockets of companies like the North West Company?

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

That's a great question, MP Ashton.

I know food security is incredibly important to the north. I was in Inuvik, Northwest Territories back in 2022 when I announced an extra $163 million of new money for Nutrition North.

I'll get right to the issue that was on APTN about a month ago. Our government is absolutely committed that 100% of the retail subsidy is to be passed on directly to northerners. We are committed to that. We have started an internal review of the program. I've personally had a meeting with the researchers who came up with that analysis, and we will continue to work together. There's an internal review of the program. Once that is done, there will be an external audit of Nutrition North, specifically on the retail subsidy.

I can say that Nutrition North is about more than just the retail subsidy. We also co-developed the harvesters support grant with northern and Indigenous partners. It's helps northern partners go out and hunt, trap and fish for traditional country foods. It's something that's incredibly popular. It's something, as I mentioned, that was co-developed with Inuit and other northern partners. It's a way to get traditional foods back into the diets of northerners.

We've also included a community food program. We're working with schools—

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Just quickly—

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

We are out of time now. I'm sorry, Ms. Ashton.

Before I go to the next round, which is going to be for five minutes, I want to reinforce that we can only have one person speaking at a time. It's impossible for the interpreters to do their job if we have people speaking over each other.

I would also say that when we have a question for the minister, we should give, perhaps, an equal amount of time for a response. That's for consideration. However, it is the member's time, and the member controls the time slot for their questions and where they want to go with them—

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

I appreciate the equal time, but that's not in the Standing Orders.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

No, I'm just—

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Time is allotted to us a members, so that's up to us, I guess.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I'm saying—

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

I hope I get a quick answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

The other piece is this: It is the member's time and we do, generally, let them direct—

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

I have a point of privilege, though.

If the member takes four minutes to ask a question on affordability, I should be given 30 seconds to answer without being interrupted.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

I'm just saying that it is the member's time. However, if we're asking questions, we should hear answers. That's what I'm going to ask that we do here.

I see Mr. Zimmer is up for the next round of questions. He has five minutes. Watch for the yellow card, because that means we're getting close to the end. With the red card, I'll cut it off and move on.

Mr. Zimmer, the floor is yours.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The question I have is—

I'm sorry. Can I start? I'm not sure if there's a point of order being made by somebody.

[The Chair, Liberal, John Aldag]

Start from the top.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Thank you.

Previously, a member from the NDP asked about food prices in the north. I'm going to be asking you about food prices and specifically how the carbon tax affects food prices in Yukon. I'm going to list some prices here. I will read this out, because it's really shocking, like some of the prices that have already been read out today.

These are stats from Yukon specifically, and these prices in Whitehorse are compared to prices in Alberta and British Columbia. First, for oranges in Alberta, it's $4.09; in British Columbia, it's $4.38; in Whitehorse, it's $6.12. For potatoes in Alberta, it's $6.98; in B.C., it's $7.04; and in Whitehorse, it's $15.85 for potatoes. For bacon in Alberta, it's $7.33 for 500 grams; in British Columbia, it's $7.38; and in Whitehorse, it's $11.17 for the same 500 grams. For one kilogram of pork chops in Alberta, it's $9.46; in British Columbia, it's $9.49; and in Whitehorse, it's $15.26. Finally, for one kilogram of sirloin steak—my last product here—in Alberta, it's $22.66; in British Columbia, it's $24.06; and in Whitehorse, it's $35.16 a kilogram.

This is certainly expensive.

I spoke with Mark today. He has a local grocery store in Dawson City. He lives in Dawson City. He goes in to work every day to try to keep prices low for his customers. I've seen it with my own eyes. He really works to keep those prices down for his neighbours, but he currently pays a 58% fuel surcharge because of the carbon tax on every grocery shipment that comes from Edmonton. That will quickly rise on April 1 to almost 70%, on top of already high food prices.

This week—you might have seen it, Minister—Yukon MLA Wade Istchenko moved a motion in the Yukon legislature to axe the carbon tax for Yukon. He lives in Yukon and sees for himself first-hand the high prices caused by the Liberal carbon tax. I think he sees it himself. It's not like we need to.... I live in northern B.C. I don't live in Yukon and experience that high a price, although we have high prices in northern B.C.

He sees these first-hand and hears from his residents and his constituents about their plight in trying to buy food and keeping food affordable in Yukon.

I'll ask this question, Minister, and I hope you can answer it quickly.

Minister, will you support the people of Yukon and exempt Yukoners from the carbon tax or will you support your colleague, Minister Guilbeault, and his promise that “as long as I'm the environment minister, there will be no more exemptions to carbon pricing”?