Evidence of meeting #18 for International Trade in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was tpp.
11:50 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
I'll ask a straightforward question. If the TPP goes through, you'll be seeking compensation on that part?
11:55 a.m.
Member and Past President, Lambton Federation of Agriculture
That's something our federal and provincial bodies will work with government on, to assess the actual impact of products coming in. I believe it is a bit open: 3.25% is the percentage that was given out for dairy. We'd have to assess the financial impact to our industry and could possibly be looking for compensation if our industry is negatively affected by the trade deal.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
Okay. I'm just trying to gauge whether your support of the TPP likely would be contingent on having compensation.
11:55 a.m.
Member and Past President, Lambton Federation of Agriculture
I would say that by the looks of the trade deal, it would have a negative impact on our industry, and we would likely look for some form of compensation to cover our losses.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
I understand. I just wanted to get that clear.
George and Glen, I want to talk about the greenhouses. I actually find it a fascinating industry and sector.
I think Japanese consumers in particular put a special emphasis on the freshness of products and the freshness of vegetables. How would the supply chain work? How would you get greenhouse-grown vegetables to Japan? With the TPP, obviously the market would be opened up, but would you be able to tap into that market?
11:55 a.m.
Chair, Ontario Greenhouse Vegetable Growers
We already have some members who are shipping tomatoes into Japan right now, so it is happening. It is all air-freighted in, of course, because tomatoes have a two-week life. You have to get the product there immediately. Right now product is being shipped direct from North America to markets in Japan.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
So that infrastructure is already in place, and I'm presuming it's scalable as the market grows.
11:55 a.m.
Chair, Ontario Greenhouse Vegetable Growers
Yes. What's affecting the scale on it, though, is the amount of products that can go in. Currently our peppers cannot go into Japan because of a phytosanitary issue on tobacco blue mould. Those are the types of protocols we have to establish with Japan to allow Ontario greenhouse peppers to be shipped in. To add value, to be able to send a collage of products there, all three—that's where we continue to add value and add efficiencies to what you're shipping over.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
Would there be value-added processes happening here in Ontario?
11:55 a.m.
Chair, Ontario Greenhouse Vegetable Growers
Absolutely. I mean, the packaging is different there. As the OGVG, we've done exploratory work in the pan-Pacific, and we see that package sizes and product sizes in fact are different over there as compared with what's normal in North America.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
I share Mr. Van Kesteren's disappointment that we weren't able to tour some of your facilities, because they sound fascinating.
11:55 a.m.
Chair, Ontario Greenhouse Vegetable Growers
Until you see it, you don't believe it. It's an untold story, and that's our fault, I guess. Our guys just want to do the work and keep the volume.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Kyle Peterson Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
That's good to hear. I appreciate that.
Mr. Naidu, you mentioned in your submission that some of the smaller and medium-sized auto parts producers will be adversely affected if the TPP comes into play. We heard from Ms. Hasenfratz that Linamar would probably benefit from it.
Is that the same dynamic that you're saying, that big players will benefit and the little ones will get squeezed out? If so, how do you balance those competing interests? Obviously both could be good for the Windsor economy. If the large guys are succeeding, they might create jobs here as well. So how do you balance those conflicting interests?
11:55 a.m.
Interim Chief Executive Officer, WindsorEssex Economic Development Corporation
I agree. The tier 1's, which have a larger footprint and resources from deep pockets to set up an operation in some of the low-cost countries, will benefit. The small and medium-sized companies that are located here, and don't have available resources, will not benefit.
I would argue that even if the large companies benefit, the benefit is not going to come to local economy, because when they benefit, they're likely going to source the products from some of those offshore countries. It is not going to be from the companies based in this region. Our local companies will not have the resources to compete with the small companies that are located in some of those low-cost countries offshore.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Randy Hoback
I'm going to have to stop you there, Mr. Peterson.
Ms. Ramsey, you have the floor.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Tracey Ramsey NDP Essex, ON
I think nothing speaks to southwestern Ontario more than a panel full of farmers and business interests working together.
George, we know each other well, and we've worked on the PACA motion,, which I hope the other parties will join me in supporting, so that we can get provision back in place.
Mr. Forbes, we've heard from many dairy farmers across the country. Two hundred head is a big dairy farm. I'm sure that's a big enterprise that you have. There are things of grave concern to us. We in the NDP are disappointed that the Liberals voted against the diafiltered milk issue we brought forward. That already costs you $220 million per year. This is already a huge hit.
We heard from dairy farmers that under the TPP they will lose $400 million per year, forever. Although there may be some compensation, it's not clear at this point if there is, what it will be, or how much it will offset. The loses are significant. For chicken farmers the losses are $150 million. We know the hit will be hard for your industry.
These phytosanitary conditions, and other non-tariff barriers, are larger issues I think for agriculture than the tariff barriers are, and those need to be addressed.
Mr. Naidu, you said that 28% of the GDP in this region comes from auto. What would the impact be if Canada would sign the TPP, and what can we do to support the auto industry instead of signing the TPP?
Noon
Interim Chief Executive Officer, WindsorEssex Economic Development Corporation
Yes, it's 28%, and although we are trying to do diversify the economy, that percentage is increasing. We're seeing more and more reliance on the auto industry. It's becoming even more important for us to support the industry locally.
What we can do instead of signing the TPP is make the treaties that we do have work better. There is another treaty that we are working on, the CETA. We find that it has opportunities. It's a treaty that will open doors for European suppliers as well as Canadian suppliers. I think we will like it.
We'd like it to be a level playing field. Foreign trade and free trade are things we live with here. As I mentioned, we're not against them. We want our small and medium-sized companies to be able to compete, and we want the growth to happen in this region. We have OEMs here. If the OEMs are affected because of the tariff phase-out that's on a different schedule compared to the U.S., and the OEMs are either downsizing or we lose them, the supply chain will be devastated. We'll lose the supply chain, and that's bad for this region. It would be extremely devastating.
Noon
NDP
Tracey Ramsey NDP Essex, ON
I'd like to go back to agriculture and talk about the import controls and how those controls aren't being properly enforced. It's ending up costing us a lot to our domestic market. What we often hear at this table from many different sectors is that what we currently have isn't working. We want to fix X, Y, and Z, but let's go into this new trade agreement. The TPP will not fix the harmonization issues that we have currently. Although there are committees that will be struck, it's unclear whether these will be fixed at that committee level.
I wonder if you could speak a little more to the harmonization issues that you see in the TPP in your sectors.
Noon
Chair, Ontario Greenhouse Vegetable Growers
I can't speak to the ones particular to the TPP, but I can speak to what we did see out of the Regulatory Cooperation Council with America. There were four main issues with regard to harmonization, which are critical to ongoing success. PACA was in that, as far as harmonization with the RCC was concerned.
There's also the North American perimeter strategy I spoke about in my remarks, which I had to rush through quickly. We need to have a North American approach on invasive pests and diseases. These are problems to us. For example, last year the Dominican Republic was banned from sending peppers into the United States because of a bug. What happened? Those immediately came to Canada. Then you get potential co-mixing of that product with our product. It hits the U.S. border and shuts our border down.
The North American strategy and the harmonization you're talking about are absolutely critical.
Noon
Director, Lambton Federation of Agriculture
By import controls, are you talking about import quota and stuff like that?
Noon
NDP
Tracey Ramsey NDP Essex, ON
Yes, there are import controls for things that are coming to the border, like the broiler chickens we see coming in. We see pizza kits. We see things that are coming in under the guise of other products, and they are passing through that border because there isn't a second inspection point there to determine whether or not they're actually being brought in under the proper category.
Noon
Director, Lambton Federation of Agriculture
Well, any import quotas are going to cause a distortion in the market. In the free market, there shouldn't be any import quotas at all, but we can't control what import quotas other countries have that affect us. For instance, I'll go back to sugar. The United States has a ban on imported sugar. We can't do that, so we use cheap imported sugar.
Noon
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Randy Hoback
We're going to have to move on, and you may get a chance to finish your answer.
Ms. Lapointe.