National Defence Committee on June 15th, 2010

[Paul Samson]

The most recent final numbers, if you will, are from 2008-09. They've actually increased a little since then. In Afghanistan, the total funding provided was $226 million. In Haiti, it was $158 million before the earthquake, so that number has gone up.

In Afghanistan, $46 million was in the health sector. That's quite a successful area. Polio eradication and other work have very concrete results. There was also basic education. Another $32 million was for emergency assistance of different kinds, including food aid, shelter, and things like that. That's very short-term. The results are more immediate.

In peace and security, which is the topic here today, we have put in almost $27 million in Afghanistan. That relates to some of the issues that were related here about creating the kind of environment... Private sector development has been important as well, and microfinance is another area where there are very concrete results.

In Haiti, it's fairly similar: we provided $158 million, as I mentioned, across private sector development, health, democratic governance, emergency assistance, and basic education. It's a fairly broad area, but it's in areas where you get very concrete results that are relatively short-term and have the intention to be sustainable, which is essential. It's essential for them to last more than a decade.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you very much.

Now I will give the floor to Mr. Hawn.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Professor Hampson, I want to pick up on what you just said about countries like Canada heading for the exits. What, in your view, should Canada be doing in Afghanistan, and for how long?

[Dr. Fen Osler Hampson]

Well, the decision has already been made, and we've been told that by the Prime Minister. He's told us that we're headed for the exits.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Yes, but I'm asking for your view.

[Dr. Fen Osler Hampson]

My view is that if this is going to be a successful operation in a counter-insurgency context, then we and others have to be prepared to stay for longer than we're prepared to stay.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Thank you.

You talked about recidivism in negotiated settlements being a historical situation. Why, in your view, has that happened? Have we not been tough enough during that process? Have we allowed too much to folks who said they were going to be good guys and who turned out to be not such good guys? Have we been naive in reaching some of those settlements?

[Dr. Fen Osler Hampson]

It's all of the above and then some. Some of the settlements were poorly crafted. There was bad statecraft. We've seen a number of cases--quite a few cases, in fact--in which that has been true.

We've also seen settlements that required large infusions of development assistance, external support, and the like, which did not flow in the way they were promised because new conflicts emerged and international donors' attentions were diverted to other regions and settings. There was also simply bad governance. Spoilers who were enticed either to become part of the political coalition or to form political parties have been thwarted because of corruption on the part of political elites.

There's the problem of state failure. These are often very poor countries in hostile neighbourhoods; sometimes you may have a peace agreement in one country, but there's instability next door, and that tends to spill across the border and undermine the very fragile peace process that was set in motion earlier on.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

How much of a problem is the west's short attention span? You talked about priorities coming, moving on, and forgetting about them. Can you give us some examples of places where we thought we had settled something, we stopped paying attention for political reasons, or whatever, our attention span seemed to be limited, and that caused problems?

[Dr. Fen Osler Hampson]

If we focus on the western hemisphere, a number of peace processes were put in place in Central America in the 1990s. We were important actors, either directly, or indirectly through support for the UN or the OAS. We're seeing recurring instability in some countries of Central America, and a lot of violence is threatening the stability of governments.

It's certainly true in parts of sub-Saharan Africa. I think it's also fair to say that even in a country like Cambodia there are continuing problems, in spite of the billions that were spent on the peace processes there.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you very much.

I want to thank all our witnesses for being with us this morning.

[Proceedings continue in camera]