It's very energizing.
Evidence of meeting #24 for Natural Resources in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was nru.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #24 for Natural Resources in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was nru.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:40 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
It's far. The work must always be done from a distance. It's hard. Still, from time to time, we tried to check whether each part of the reactor was operating properly. Occasionally we found things that needed improvement.
4:45 p.m.
Bloc
Paule Brunelle Bloc Trois-Rivières, QC
In terms of communications, you say you want to provide accurate information, as extensively as possible, as quickly as possible, but it seems to me, as my mother used to say, that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
Could you take more measures from now on so that the reactor doesn't deteriorate to the point where it has to be shut down for a few months? We don't even know whether we might have to shut it down for good. Can this sort of thing be foreseen, given the reactor's age?
4:45 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
It's important to remember that in 2006, when AECL came to ask for a licence renewal for five years, we had done a comprehensive review of all the components and all the safety. You will remember those upgrades and those backup powers. They all came from that review.
We are continuously trying to improve this facility to make sure that it is working as safely as possible, so the answer is yes, we are trying to do this. When they have to come for the new renewal in 2011, they'll have to show us all the things that need to be improved in order for us to agree that it's safe to allow them to operate beyond 2011.
4:45 p.m.
Bloc
Paule Brunelle Bloc Trois-Rivières, QC
Do the extended shutdown of the reactor and all the work involved cause you to reconsider the renewal or extension of this licence? If I represented the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission, I'd be asking myself a lot of questions.
4:45 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
We're going to look at a good number of questions. We've signed a protocol. A lot of projects and information are going to be submitted in August, and these will have to comply with all the required conditions. Public hearings will then be held, and this will enable a lot of people to ask questions.
4:45 p.m.
Bloc
Paule Brunelle Bloc Trois-Rivières, QC
Do you use a procedure that allows you to specify that the seriousness of a situation is level 2, 3, 4 or 5, for example? How do you measure the situation at Chalk River? Do you use codes that indicate that the situation should be checked or is very alarming, for example?
4:45 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
Yes. Every time there's a cause of action, we examine each part, each stage, very carefully.
4:45 p.m.
Bloc
Paule Brunelle Bloc Trois-Rivières, QC
If I understand your answer correctly, you believe that this whole situation at Chalk River does not require you to change your procedures. You think that they are perfectly all right and you're not afraid of future heavy water leaks or other major problems.
4:45 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
No. Right now we have discovered this corrosion issue. Now AECL will have to determine the extent of the corrosion. If they come up with a solution on how to repair the vessel, they'll have to come to us and prove to our satisfaction that they can power it up safely. We will be working with them to make sure that they understand what we need to make sure that whatever they do will run safely. So yes, there's a lot of work to do right now to convince us that they can restart it safely.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit
You have two minutes. Actually, no, you have one minute and ten seconds.
Go ahead.
4:45 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC
Good afternoon.
In your presentation, you said that the heavy water that evaporated and that continues to evaporate does not really constitute a danger for the population, since these are minute quantities that are involved. Have you ever observed times in the past when large quantities of heavy water escaped that might have been a threat to public health and the environment? In view of the events we are going through at present, do you consider that a reactor that is over 50 years old can still remain safe in the long term?
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
In answer to the second question, the answer is yes, as long as were convinced that all the improvements that should be made are really going to be carried out.
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
Absolutely not.
We will not prejudge the outcome. They will have to come to us with an extensive safety case that says that continuing with this machine is safe.
Just so everybody understands, if we for one second believe that this machine is unsafe, we will shut it down. Just so everybody understands, that's our mandate. Our mandate is purely safety. If they cannot come up with a safety case, our responsibility is to shut it down. So what they have to do is worry about how to satisfy the commission that they are doing everything possible to keep the machine running.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Leon Benoit
Merci, Monsieur Malo.
We'll go to Mr. Cullen for up to seven minutes. Go ahead, please.
4:50 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you, gentlemen, for being here.
I want to sort of go to that last point you made, sir. You report to the Minister of Natural Resources, is that right?
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
I'd like to correct this. I report to Parliament--to you--through the Minister of Natural Resources. She deposits our annual budget and so on, because I cannot do it.
4:50 p.m.
NDP
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
All the public information associated with our business is posted on our website.
4:50 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
You said that when the machine is unsafe, you shut it down. Is that what happened prior to Christmas in 2007?
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
I wasn't here, so that's really difficult in hindsight.
4:50 p.m.
President, Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission
There was a disagreement.
Let me tell you. We did a Talisman report on lessons learned from what happened in 2007 that caused this problem. They came up with 60 recommendations, but you can boil it down to basically three: they said that they didn't have a good tracking record; the licence was not clear, so there was a debate between the licensee and the regulator; and they weren't communicating properly. Therefore, there was disagreement about what the problem was.