Evidence of meeting #9 for Official Languages in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was programs.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
I don't want to lose my speaking time, Mr. Chairman. That wasn't a point of order.
The other aspect concerns ambassadors, who are not required to be bilingual. Canada must set an example.
Messrs. Chouinard and Thibault, does your association have a mandate to make students officially bilingual?
9:55 a.m.
Administrator, Director General of the Collège communautraire du Nouveau-Brunswick, Réseau des cégeps et collèges francophones du Canada
No.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
All right.
Ms. Stewart and Mr. Allain, do you have a mandate to make students bilingual by the time they earn their degrees?
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
If I understand correctly, the members of your association teach a second language at the primary and secondary levels.
9:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Association of Second Language Teachers
They also teach at the postsecondary level. So the faculties at the postsecondary level, teacher training—
9:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Association of Second Language Teachers
We teach both French as a second language and English as a second language.
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Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
All right. If I understand correctly, you have a specific mandate to ensure that people learn their second language across Canada.
I taught French in high school in Saskatchewan and Ontario. Groups like Canadian Parents for French encouraged their children, whose mother tongue was French, to study at immersion schools. So we had trouble retaining Franco-Ontarian students, whose numbers declined, with all the consequences that can have for the schools. So that increased the number of immersion students and hurt the French fact.
Is the situation still the same?
9:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Association of Second Language Teachers
It's less and less the case; it's even the contrary. The policy changed a number of years ago. Minority francophone groups provide far more statistics to parents. The francophone schools can offer increasingly relevant and interesting programs. Students in immersion programsand look at their genealogy and claim they are rights holders and enter minority francophone programs. Of course, they don't always enrol, but people are nevertheless interested in studying in a francophone minority school.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
If those rights holders attended an English school to learn French, they wouldn't be in the right place.
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Executive Director, Canadian Association of Second Language Teachers
Precisely. I see that people are increasingly in the right place.
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Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
So the situation is improving.
When they're hired, do college and university teachers have to be bilingual?
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Administrator, Director General of the Collège communautraire du Nouveau-Brunswick, Réseau des cégeps et collèges francophones du Canada
No. The francophone colleges are trying to get francophone staff who are highly qualified in their field of specialization.
9:55 a.m.
Past President, Canadian Association of University Teachers
The situation is slightly different. It isn't done formally. We represent the members of the academic staff of Quebec's anglophone universities. It is difficult to be a unilingual anglophone in that province. Even if it were a formal requirement, someone who couldn't get along in French would have trouble, whether it be at Concordia, McGill or Bishop's.
There are also bilingual universities in Ontario, such as the University of Ottawa and Laurentian University.
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Bloc
Richard Nadeau Bloc Gatineau, QC
Are you telling me that all the professors at the University of Ottawa are bilingual?
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Conservative
The Chair Conservative Steven Blaney
Mr. Nadeau, you'll be able to come back to your question.
We'll continue with Mr. Godin.
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NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I'd like to welcome you. I apologize for arriving late. I was at the doctor's office. As you can see, I have the flu.
I had a point of order, and I agree that it wasn't really one. The five minutes are ours and we ask the questions we want to ask.
That's an example of the way the government operates. A Supreme Court judge could be appointed without being bilingual. The act is drafted in English and in French. It is not translated, but written in French. And yet, after all that, we ask the translators, with all due respect to them, to translate that act for the judge—even if we don't allow it to be translated—so that he can make a final decision, because there is no further recourse after the Supreme Court.
We're talking about deputy ministers who aren't bilingual. The government's message is that bilingualism isn't very important in the country, even if Canada is a bilingual country. The government is a major employer. I worked in the mines. I remember giving the following example. When the company wanted to hire people to operate heavy equipment, it said what it needed. It did the same if it needed an electrician. When the public service needs staff, what is the government's position? It operates as though bilingualism were not necessary, despite the fact that Canada is a bilingual country by law. And yet they are the ones who will have to train those people. Wouldn't it be preferable for it to be done by the institutions?
Why don't you make that request? Will you have the means to do it with qualified people by working jointly with the employer? In fact, you represent employers, since you provide training to the people they'll be hiring later. Isn't it possible to solve this problem once and for all?
10 a.m.
Director General, Learning Policy and Planning Directorate, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
Thank you.
I'm not here to answer questions on the bilingualism policies of the Government of Canada.
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NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
You can answer in accordance with the act. We have an official, bilingual act.
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Director General, Learning Policy and Planning Directorate, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
I'm here to talk about the postsecondary education programs offered by our department. I don't have the necessary jurisdiction to talk about—
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NDP
Yvon Godin NDP Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Mr. Chairman, in those conditions...
Then answer Mr. Allain. He says there is a five-year program, but that they wait until the last minute and then they have to wait two years to get more funding. They're going to lose specialists. What is the government's response to that?
10 a.m.
Sylvain Segard Director General, Program Policy and Planning Directorate, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development Canada
Thank you, sir. My name is Sylvain Segard. I am director general, program policy, at the learning policy directorate of the Department of Human Resources. I played a dual role when I was appointed outgoing champion of postsecondary recruitment for my department. In that capacity, I was responsible for working with all my manager colleagues at the department to organize a campaign to recruit talented graduates from university institutions. We're making efforts every year in this field. We're trying to improve year to year by attempting to reach most Canadian institutions as well as—