Official Languages Committee on June 8th, 2010

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

All right. So we also have work to do. I hope the 12 colleagues will do it together.

Commissioner, I also sent you a letter from VANOC. We know there were some problems before and during the games. After the games, all the Bloc Québécois members—and I don't know whether that was the case of my colleagues from the other parties—received a letter and a parcel containing a very nice outfit bearing the games logo. However, the letter sent to the Bloc Québécois members was written in English only. We wrote to Mr. Furlong, and we gave him an ultimatum. The letter was dated March 25, but we didn't receive it until the end of May. We also received the outfits in our constituencies. We checked to see whether the mistake only affected me, but we realized that the situation was the same everywhere.

We wrote a letter in French and English. We told Mr. Furlong we wanted him to write in French. If he wanted us to be real ambassadors... We were good princes since we wrote the letter to Mr. Furlong in both official languages. We still haven't received an answer. We sent a certified copy of the letter to Mr. Aubut of the Canadian Olympic Committee.

What's your reaction to this situation? The federal government isn't doing its job and isn't setting an example. The Canadian Olympic Committee is a paragovernmental organization and it operates in accordance with the same philosophy as the government. French is secondary. They send us a nice gift and wash the pill down by sending us a letter in English.

[Graham Fraser]

I find that unfortunate.

As you know, you did a lot of work on the Olympic Games; we did as well. I mentioned that in the preface to the annual report.

I find it unfortunate that actions like that and ceremonies that triggered a lot of complaints cast a shadow on the games as such, whereas, in the field, an enormous effort was made by the federal institutions, volunteers and even private companies to welcome visitors in both official languages and to provide services.

So I find it unfortunate, after so much effort by so many people, and, in many respects, successes in the field, that a lack of reflexive action should cast a shadow on those successes.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you very much, Mr. Nadeau.

We'll continue with Ms. O'Neill-Gordon.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to welcome all of you here this morning. It's nice to have you back with us to explain some of your ideas and to hear what you have to say.

As you all know, as part of our study this committee has been working on and has been looking quite extensively at the road map during our study for the linguistic duality. In your report, you highlighted it as a key instrument in the government's work towards linguistic duality, and we certainly have found that during our study as we went along.

The road map differs quite greatly from the action plan, and not least in its funding. The level of funding put in place was $1.1 billion. Now, that's $1.1 billion over five years. We'll be seeing work done in cultural components. More money has been put into the music showcases, which were non-existent under the prior program, as well as the translation program.

The prior action plan, we learned, only covered eight departments, whereas this new plan now covers 15 departments, which is a great addition to it.

While recognizing—and we all know it—that there's always room for improvement, would you say that the road map improved upon the action plan? And in what specific areas do you see the improvement?

[Graham Fraser]

I hesitate to get into the details, because we are continuing to monitor the details of the rollout of the plan. I was pleased to see the addition of the cultural component you referred to. I've been pleased to see the investment in immigration. There are elements regarding second language learning that I think are important.

On the other hand, as I said earlier, I was sorry to see that there has been a reduction of the component for language training within the public sector. As you pointed out, the program was the renewal of a $750 million program into a $1.1 billion program. With the addition of the cultural element and the nature of inflation, I think there are some substantial similarities in terms of the gross amount. I was able to learn after the fact why the cultural component had not originally been included. The cultural sector at that point was simply not prepared to enter into the kind of process of accountability and management of public funds that it then reached the point that it was able to do so.

I think the one is a renewal of the other. There have been some re-calibrations and shifts along the way. There are some things that have been strengthened. There are other things in that shift of priorities that.... As I say, I was sorry to see there was a diminution in the investment in language training in the public sector. But I'm not in a position to go into a more detailed financial accounting, if you like, of the two.

If I can just come back to a question on the consultation we had on the regulation, which was raised by Mr. Bélanger, we were consulted in 2001 on the modification of the regulation at that point. That was before my time, but it was the change to the regulation that took into account the Supreme Court judgment on Donnie Doucet. So there have been some in the past, but that was prior to having the position I now hold.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

As a New Brunswicker, I have to say that I'm very happy with what we've got--having a $1.1 million allotment. As an educator, I sure hope a lot goes into the education system. That's where we have to start in order to have our children be able to speak both languages.

I also want to see what you think of the linguistic--

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Ms. O'Neil-Gordon. Your time is already up.

We'll continue with Mr. Godin.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Commissioner, to continue along the lines of what Ms. O'Neill-Gordon was saying, I would say that, as a New Brunswicker, I'm not that happy.

It will be remembered that, with regard to education in New Brunswick, in the immersion schools, it went from grade 1 to grade 5, and 350 anglophones demonstrated in Fredericton. So I don't know what she can see, as a teacher, that makes her so happy, considering the setback that represents. In the health field, all the equipment is in the anglophone hospitals, whereas the francophone hospitals have nothing at all. We can monitor all the efforts that are made in the health field in New Brunswick.

I may be a little less happy than she is. I know she represents the government, so she has to speak for the government.

When you consider the Roadmap and the funding that has been allocated to immigration, you see that $10 million was allocated to New Brunswick. And yet we were told last week that the announcement was made two years ago, but that the program is only starting—

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Pardon me, Mr. Godin, but we have a point of order.

Mrs. O'Neill-Gordon.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

I want to make it clear that talking about what you're doing about the education system...it certainly has gone backwards in the last year. That's a provincial matter, and it's the same with the health position.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

That's debate; that's not a point of order.

[Tilley O'Neill-Gordon]

I just wanted to make....

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Ms. O'Neill-Gordon, that is not a point of order; it is more a matter of debate.

Thank you.

Go ahead.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

The $10 million for immigration was supposedly allocated two years ago, and we're told it's only now that the money is starting to be distributed through ACOA. I wonder what kind of program this is, whether there is any follow-up. Will the money really go to promote francophone immigration to New Brunswick or rather for immigration in general? All these points have to be studied.

As regards transfers from Moncton to Halifax, commissioner, you said that Nova Scotia isn't subject to the Official Languages Act at the federal level. Perhaps you could explain that. Except that, if the program is going to serve Canada or all of the Atlantic provinces, perhaps it's the same thing.

Go quickly, please, because I have other important questions to ask.

[Graham Fraser]

I'd like to clarify one point. I didn't say that Nova Scotia isn't subject to the Official Languages Act. Instead I said it isn't a designated bilingual region for language of work purposes. That means that people are entitled to federal government services, but that public servants who work in Halifax don't have a right to work in French, which makes that more difficult—

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

But if the people are transferred in order to provide service to all the Atlantic provinces, shouldn't that be reviewed again?

[Graham Fraser]

Indeed, there have been some discussions on this matter. That said, we think it's more difficult for a federal institution to provide services in both languages if employees don't have the right to work in the language of their choice. That's why we say all these issues are related.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Now let's talk about the Supreme Court judges. The minister told us here in committee that he had voted against my bill on the Supreme Court judges because it divided Canadians. If the minister of Canadian Heritage thinks that a bill on the Supreme Court judges, which concerns only nine judges out of 33 million people, divides Canadians, do you think they'll be concerned to say they're going to provide bilingual services in Vancouver or Nova Scotia and that they're going to require public servants to work in both official languages, with that kind of attitude coming from the top? Aren't those divisive comments rather than unifying comments?

[Graham Fraser]

I don't want to attribute motives for comments made in a political debate. Someone says that the questions divides the country. All I can say in response is that every political question divides the country. That's the nature of political and democratic debate. When an event occurs that requires a vote, some people support it, others oppose it. That's the nature of democratic debate.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

To be a judge, doesn't a person have to be a lawyer?

[Graham Fraser]

Absolutely.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Earlier Mr. Weston said there were absolutely no bilingual judges in Vancouver. However, I thought that the judge of the British Columbia court of appeal was completely bilingual. So we could appoint a person—

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

A point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Pardon me, Mr. Godin, but there is a point of order.