Official Languages Committee on Nov. 25th, 2013

[Lise St-Denis, Liberal, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

In the case of Toronto, do immersion programs bring anything to the overall community socially, culturally or economically? Is it positive? People sign their children up, but does that do anything for the community? Are they recognized for it? In your opinion, are that attitude and affiliation important?

[Scott Moreash]

Certainly, we believe it does. Our French immersion programs are a very important part of the overall program offerings that we have as a school board, as the second-largest school board in the country. Certainly, they bring a vitality to our program offerings, which we are very proud of.

[Shawn Moynihan]

And we've been able to take advantage of opportunities provided by the Ministry of Education to really focus on heightening awareness and understanding of French culture. We've provided many opportunities with artistic events or field trips, or things like that, which we think have really contributed to a positive feeling in the community.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis.

Now we'll go to Madam Bateman. You have the floor.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My thanks to all our witnesses. I have questions for you all.

First of all, Mrs. Lalonde, I am the mother of two students enrolled in immersion programs. I am really interested in knowing your opinion of the level of French necessary to attend a university in Canada entirely in French.

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

I could not tell you the precise level and skills required. However, the language level of each student is assessed the moment they arrive at any university that offers its programs in French. It must be said that most universities have programs in French and in English but only some are strictly French-speaking. Based on the students’ skills when they arrive at a university or college, a plan is established that will allow their language or writing abilities in French to develop. Students are supported in their university courses.

Of course, a basic knowledge of French is required. But all students who have been in immersion programs in elementary school or high school generally have the skills they need to take courses at university level.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Thank you.

In general, what percentage of your students come from immersion programs?

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

About 24,000 to 25,000 students are studying in French. Of that number, 5,000 students come from immersion programs.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Very good.

Mr. Moynihan, you said that almost 25% of your elementary students were in immersion programs. What is the percentage in grades 7, 9 and 12?

[Shawn Moynihan]

We have a strong program throughout the elementary years, from grade 1 to grade 8. We have a fairly low rate of attrition. The reason most frequently given that students leave the French immersion program before they go to secondary school is that they choose another option, such as a regional program—for example, a school for the arts or something like that. Our attrition rates from grades one to eight are very low.

Regarding high school, we're in the process of beginning a review of our secondary school programs. In about one year we'll have more information about exactly why there's attrition.

We also have—

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

What is the percentage in grade 12? Are we talking about 10%, 5% or 20%?

What is the percentage of students that you have in French immersion programs in grade 12, for example?

[Shawn Moynihan]

We don't have the data presently for secondary school. That's something that we're engaged in. We have a project on the go to take a look at a—

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Just a ballpark number. How many teachers do you have for your grade 12 programs, and are 10% of them French-speaking teachers? Just a ballpark number is fine, because typically there's a huge attrition rate. There's an enormous investment up front and then there's a huge attrition rate.

[Scott Moreash]

What I can tell you is that we have three or four secondary school French immersion programs from which we are graduating students, whereas at the elementary level we would have in the range of 20 or 30, or even higher, sites where we offer French immersion.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

So 30 versus three or four.

[Shawn Moynihan]

Correct.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

When are you going to have that data?

[Scott Moreash]

We're engaged in a similar French immersion review of our secondary programs. That data should be available in the fall.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

What do you anticipate? If it's available this fall, what do you anticipate? This is not unique to the Peel district.

[Shawn Moynihan]

We would anticipate that there would be a variety of factors. I just want to clarify, through the chair, that you're asking about pursuing French immersion to obtain the certificate. Is that correct?

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Yes, to graduate in French immersion.

[Shawn Moynihan]

So, anecdotally—

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

For that matter, some schools have international baccalaureate programs that start in grade 10 and so there's a dropout at that level because they're only choosing to offer it in one language, but there's a higher level of language demanded, which traditionally French immersion students excel at.

[Shawn Moynihan]

Yes, and anecdotally we would say that you're right on with things like the international baccalaureate programs. Anecdotally we would have students say that they pursue other things like regional programs, like international baccalaureates, and that their schedules become very crowded and it's harder for them to continue to take the French immersion courses in secondary school. We've heard that anecdotally so far.

[Joyce Bateman, Conservative, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Do you offer IB programming, and if you do, do you offer it in both languages?