Evidence of meeting #66 for Public Accounts in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was rcmp.
A recording is available from Parliament.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Brian Fitzpatrick
I'm calling this meeting to order.
Mr. Williams had a point of order that I think is important, so maybe we'll just deal with it before we get into our regular meeting.
Go ahead, Mr. Williams.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
John Williams Conservative Edmonton—St. Albert, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
At the end of the committee meeting yesterday we made reference to a letter from Superintendent Paulson, regarding an investigation that he was conducting. It was quite clearly indicated that he was using, as part of his investigation, testimony from the public accounts committee. He also indicated that his investigation was nearing a completion. I think he also asked that we waive parliamentary privilege to allow him to use that information—which of course he doesn't have access to, but which he's using nonetheless.
Anyway, my point is that I think you, in conjunction with the law clerk, should write to Superintendent Paulson, telling him to cease and desist his investigation and any other investigation that he or the RCMP is contemplating, and that they cannot use testimony from before this committee—which is, in essence, intimidating witnesses—until such time when we release or give authority for him to use the testimony.
I think you'll find an agreement among the committee members that the chair, in conjunction with the law clerk, should write to Superintendent Paulson to tell him to cease and desist, and so on.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
3:30 p.m.
Some hon. members
Agreed.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Brian Fitzpatrick
I think something should be understood. They're free to carry out their own investigations, but they cannot use, as the basis of their investigation, the evidence that is given before this committee. That's the main focus—
3:30 p.m.
NDP
David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON
Further to that, they have to have other outside sources to legitimize even the beginning of the investigation. If the investigation is predicated on that testimony, this letter should have the effect of immediately halting that investigation. It would only continue if they have other evidence or should Parliament decide to waive its privilege.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
John Williams Conservative Edmonton—St. Albert, AB
I don't want to belabour the point, Mr. Chairman. I was just appalled, as I said yesterday, and I'm still that way.
3:30 p.m.
Bloc
Jean-Yves Laforest Bloc Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC
Mr. Chairman, I would like to give notice that I would like to table a notice of motion at the end of the meeting, after we have heard the testimony. I would ask for unanimous consent to discuss this motion right after we are finished with the witnesses if committee members agree. I will speak to the notice of motion later on.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
On a point of order, Mr. Chair, I would like to seek clarification from you.
Yesterday I alerted the committee to the very unusual discovery that we made when Mr. Pelletier came before this committee, when he said the Privy Council Office had contacted him and asked that he look into a donation to the Liberal Party. Of course, it would be very unusual behaviour on the part of our federal bureaucracy to be looking into donations to a political party.
I just want to make sure about my request of yesterday, that we write to the Privy Council Office right now to learn about the nature of this interaction. I just want to make sure I have officially given formal notice of motion for tomorrow's meeting, so that this can be acted upon.
It was not made clear yesterday by the chair whether or not notice had been given, and I don't want this to be delayed any more. It is, I think you'll agree, Mr. Chair, very unusual behaviour for the bureaucracy to be looking into donations to the Liberal Party.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Brian Fitzpatrick
I interpreted the discussion yesterday as an agreement from this committee to proceed on the basis that you were requesting. That's my interpretation, and it's in the minutes as well.
3:30 p.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
Mr. Chair, since you're on this issue, can I just clarify with the clerk that it was my understanding that Mr. Pelletier was given two weeks to respond in writing? I believe it was to that question and one or two others on which he wasn't completely clear. At the end of the meeting, the chair said Mr. Pelletier would have two weeks to get back to us in writing, which is what the lawyer had requested. If it's tied in, I think we should be waiting that two weeks.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Brian Fitzpatrick
There'll be a meeting tomorrow, at which we'll be able to deal with all of these issues.
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
Okay, but the clerk can confirm that the chair did give him two weeks to do that.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
My request is to have the Privy Council explain its role.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Brian Fitzpatrick
Order. The discussion goes through the chair.
I think we'll get this matter sorted out tomorrow.
We have some witnesses who have travelled a ways with some important testimony and—
3:35 p.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Relevant to the witnesses before us today, we had a commitment from Casey Computing that they would provide us with a list of the approximately 20 RCMP officers who received tickets to hockey games. I'm inquiring whether or not that will be tabled today. As of yet, I haven't seen that document arrive.
3:35 p.m.
Pat Casey As an Individual
It is prepared and will arrive within the ten days, as requested.