Veterans Affairs Committee on May 8th, 2007

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

Thank you, gentlemen.

Now on to Mr. Valley for five minutes.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

One of the things you mentioned was about some of the health care barriers that are in place and how we have to constantly search them out to try to make sure the veterans don't fall through the cracks.

We had testimony--or whatever you want to call it--on April 24, and some of us were surprised, and maybe shouldn't have been, to hear that some of our currently serving members in the Canadian Forces are receiving pensions while they're still serving. Do they receive them from Veterans Affairs?

[Brian Ferguson]

Yes, and that was a system that ended, actually, when the new Veterans Charter came into being on April 1, 2006. They're still eligible for a disability award, but the pension system that existed prior to that no longer exists for anybody applying for a disability benefit.

So they still are eligible for disability benefits, but they're not in the form of a pension. For example, if someone loses a hand and remains in the Canadian Forces in some capacity, they would be compensated for that under the new Veterans Charter, the same as anybody else would for losing a limb.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

So the pension aspect ended with the introduction of the new charter?

[Brian Ferguson]

That's correct.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

I don't know that some of our witnesses are aware of that, because they identified that as one of the key problems with some of the health promotion techniques they were trying to use to help these individuals get over some of their health situations.

[Brian Ferguson]

Now, it ended for new applications, but the people who had already gotten into the previous system were grandfathered. So there would be continuing pension benefits going to anybody who actually had received a pension prior to that date.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

Yes, but I think the message we got, and I could be wrong, is that this was an ongoing problem, so I don't know that they're aware of that.

[Brian Ferguson]

No. It was that individuals in the CF were getting pensions while serving. As of April 1, they get a disability award.

[Darragh Mogan]

If I might ask, just for clarification, was the issue that they were getting a disability pension or a disability award while they were serving? In other words, some might say they're almost getting a salary increment while they're serving and somebody else who is serving isn't. We've heard that.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

It was the opinion of one of the individuals--and again, I'm careful not to put words in somebody's mouth--that this was a disincentive to getting better, for some of the issues they suffered under, because they were receiving a pension while still serving. One of the individuals felt that was a big barrier to helping the physicians treat the patients.

[Brian Ferguson]

In fact, I think we identified that as a barrier in the diagnostique leading up to the change that we implemented with the new Veterans Charter, which--

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

Well, I'm glad to hear that, because we were concerned when we heard that, that this was something we had done through legislation to create a problem that is going to hurt our veterans in the future.

[Brian Ferguson]

In this case, we've actually eliminated that system.

[Roger Valley, Liberal, Kenora, ON]

Good.

I don't have any more questions at this time, Mr. Chair. I won't allow you to cut me off; I'll cut myself off.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

Okay. Normally, I would ask Mr. St. Denis if he wants two minutes, but he's otherwise occupied.

We will move on to Mr. Sweet, then, for five minutes.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I have a couple of things, quickly. Are the inbound calls from veterans to the client service personnel taped or monitored at any time for quality control?

[Brian Ferguson]

To my knowledge, no, but I'll double-check and get back to you on that, sir.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Okay.

[Brian Ferguson]

To my knowledge, at this table, I don't believe so. I certainly have never received any direction to do so.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Sometimes given the responses I hear that some veterans get, it would be good to know this is being checked to make sure that the people actually understand how to relate to veterans.

On that note, by the way, I do like your point that “a Veteran is a Veteran is a Veteran”. I wonder, when we say traditional veterans and modern-day veterans, whether we sometimes inadvertently create a class structure. I'm careful, though, to say that I know it's not intentional. Anyway, I like that terminology of yours much more.

I seldom would ever speak for the whole committee, but I think everybody was impressed by the Gerontological Advisory Council report, when we had the opportunity to question the council about it. I just have to say that the more of that report you actually incorporate into your services, the more pleased we'll be than ever.

I also want to say that all of us get lots of calls. I have two military bases in my riding and I certainly like to get the calls, but the calls not only have our staff busy, they're also heart-wrenching in most cases. I just wanted to say to you very directly, but empathetically as well, because I understand the amount of work you have to do, that if your work right now—and I'm certain it is—is going to mean less administration and that we're going to have a program that's sustainable and one that's going to meet the needs out there and be timely, then I'm all for it, but just make sure you don't waste even a day ensuring we can deliver that and encapsulate as many of the needs of our veterans, of every degree, we can.

I was quite concerned when we heard from the advisory council that some provinces are actually now refusing basic care to veterans and are asking Veterans Affairs.... That was what they said at the time when we questioned them. I don't know if you looked at the blues on that.

Is that the case?

[Brian Ferguson]

To my knowledge, no, but certainly what I explained earlier is my understanding of how we work.

I don't know whether, Darragh, you want to add anything to that, but as Darragh said, we have really good cooperation with our provincial colleagues. The fact that we've got 50 client service teams on the ground means they interact with their counterparts in the provinces continually.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Is it Mr. Marshall? Who is it?

[Brian Ferguson]

Yes.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

He said there are three provinces now who are asking Veterans Affairs to pay for basic care for veterans.