Debates of Feb. 7th, 2012

Joyce Murray Vancouver Quadra, BC

Madam Speaker, I feel compelled to respond to the comments of the Conservative minister on this debate.

I find it hugely insulting that the minister considers debate in the House of Commons to be simply to delay and stymie the process. What is he referring to by stymying the process? This is the process. This is the way in which elected members of Parliament, as the NDP member just mentioned, reflect concerns about a piece of legislation. They are legitimate concerns. They are concerns that we have heard from the RCMP, from police chiefs, from civil society right across the country. Debate is the way that members reflect that. It is the way that members represent their constituents who want to have a voice. They want to know that their members of Parliament are listening to their concerns and are reflecting them here.

This is not about delaying. It is not about stymying--

The Deputy Speaker Denise Savoie

Order, please. The hon. Minister of Public Safety.

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, I am curious to know when the member thinks she has not had an opportunity to put her position on the long gun registry on the public record here in the House, in committee, or otherwise. If over the years that she has been here she has not been able to express her opinion very clearly on the issue, I would be surprised.

Perhaps we could check the record to see if indeed she has made any comments. If she has not made any comments, all I can say is, where has she been?

Jasbir Sandhu Surrey North, BC

Madam Speaker, I am a new member to this chamber. There are many rules and regulations and things to learn in Ottawa. One of the things I have learned about in the last six or seven months is time allocation. Thanks to my colleagues in the Conservative Party, I now know what time allocation is. It is denying my right to speak on behalf of my constituents to represent their views.

The minister says that this issue has been talked about for 17 years. My constituents would like to have a voice in this chamber. What do I tell them about the government not allowing their member to speak in the House?

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, he can say to his constituents that he voted in favour of retaining the long gun registry, a registry that in fact criminalizes hunters, sports shooters and farmers and that he wants to see those individuals penalized through the criminal process. He can also tell them that he has consistently voted against measures that would protect victims and that would protect children from sexual predators. Those are the things he can tell them.

It is very clear on the record. He can go back and tell his constituents exactly what he has done in the House.

Jean Rousseau Compton—Stanstead, QC

Madam Speaker, the government's insults and personal attacks show what this debate has come to. There is no debate, merely personal attacks. The Conservatives say that they have wanted to make this change for years. This government's attitude has not evolved. It is closed-minded and not at all open to hearing other points of view. We have proposed reasonable amendments to this bill, but the government has never listened. It is still not listening to us. There is no democracy in the House. The opposition represents 60% of Canadians, but still there is no debate in the House. This situation has to end immediately. The Chair should rule on this. We never get answers to our questions because there is never any debate.

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, I have never heard this individual raise this question in the House in terms of the long gun registry. In question period I certainly have not had a question from him on that. If he has not taken advantage of the opportunities to debate the bill over the past number of months, I am somewhat surprised.

As for personal attacks, I find that quite astounding. I have not made any personal attacks. I have simply indicated in response to a question from the NDP member for Surrey North asking what he is supposed to tell his constituents. I said to tell them the truth, tell them exactly where he stands on various issues, including the long gun registry and issues related to penalties against those who would abuse children. He should tell them exactly where he stands.

Ted Hsu Kingston and the Islands, ON

Madam Speaker, I was not going to enter this debate, but then I heard something from the minister that made me realize it is worth standing up and countering what the government says.

The minister is accusing us of criminalizing hunters and sports shooters. That is not the intent, nor is it the actual effect of the long gun registry. Every time the Conservatives say that, we have to stand and say that is wrong, that it is not true. That is one of the reasons we need to continue this debate. Everything has to be countered. On every argument that is brought up, light has to be shed on what the government is saying, the things that are not true.

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, I am puzzled. The long gun registry was passed pursuant to Parliament's criminal law power. A breach of that provision is a breach of the criminal law. A person who breaches the criminal law and is found guilty is a criminal.

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, I think I have heard all the arguments that could possibly be made in respect to this bill. The argument essentially boils down to the opposition wanting to criminalize the farmers, hunters and sports shooters in my riding. Having said that, I do not know what the opposition members want to do once they have criminalized them. We know they do not want to send anyone to prison. Hopefully they do not want to send farmers, hunters and sports shooters to prison for this.

The point remains that it is a criminal offence for a decent, law-abiding, ordinary individual not to register a firearm even though that individual is properly licensed to acquire a firearm.

Marc-André Morin Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Madam Speaker, as for breaking the law, it was voted on by Parliament under a previous government. This government strongly urged gun owners to disobey the law and gladly promised that it would scrap the legislation. Encouraging people to disobey the law—and then accusing others of wanting to criminalize them after the fact—is just wrong.

Earlier, the minister mentioned the very young ages of some of our elected representatives. I have a great deal of admiration for my party's young MPs. These young people are serious, hard-working individuals who are doing an excellent job. The minister needs to remember that we were all elected to Parliament and we all represent Canadians. If he wants to base his actions on the legitimacy of his mandate and act nonsensically, leading the procedure any which way, I must remind him that there are rules we must follow. That is all we are asking for today.

Vic Toews Provencher, MB

Madam Speaker, perhaps we could start quoting some of the member's caucus colleagues.

The member for Sackville—Eastern Shore in Nova Scotia said this:

I have had this view since 1995. I have always believed that the gun registry is a failure in principle and a failure in policy, and that we could do much better with different policies.

That is exactly it. Let us get this broken policy behind us and get effective policies reflected in laws that actually target criminals and not honest law-abiding citizens.

Jinny Sims Newton—North Delta, BC

Madam Speaker, what we are debating right now is time allocation and not the merits of the bill on which time allocation has been moved.

As a new parliamentarian, I notice that in this Parliament it seems the hon. members across the aisle have very little respect for the democratic process. The democratic parliamentary process is to have the bills read at different stages, not to fly through them under time allocation. All members in this House should be able to deliberate and represent points of view from their ridings and to listen to the points being made by other members. What I am seeing over and over again is an attempt to silence any opposition.

My question for the minister is, what do you have to hide that you want to shut up any debate in this House?