Debates of May 29th, 2023

Department of Finance—Main Estimates, 2023-24

[The Deputy Chair, NDP, Carol Hughes]

The hon. leader of the official opposition.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, does that include charging HST on the carbon tax, a tax on a tax, yes or no?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, the point is this: Does the member have a plan to fight climate change or does he not?

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, the point is, does the government plan to tax the tax? Will the HST apply to the carbon tax, yes or no?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, the point is that the Conservatives want to behave as if Canada can be an ostrich putting its head in the sand.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, the point is that Canadians cannot afford to pay any more.

Will she charge the HST on the carbon tax, yes or no?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, what Canadians cannot afford is an official opposition that denies the fact that climate change is real and denies the—

[The Deputy Chair, NDP, Carol Hughes]

The hon. leader of the official opposition.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, that is false.

We will assume that she intends to tax the tax. That means that Canadians will pay once with the carbon tax and then twice for the tax on the tax. What will be the full cost of the carbon tax per litre be once the tax, and the tax on the tax, are fully implemented? How much will it be?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, the leader of the official opposition just said that it was false that he does not have a climate plan. Does that mean he is sticking with the previous Conservative leader's climate plan? That was what he was elected on.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, the question was this: How much will it be per litre once the carbon tax is fully implemented? How much?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, the point is that, in the 21st century, the world is building a clean economy. The Conservatives are in denial about that. That is a disservice to all—

[The Deputy Chair, NDP, Carol Hughes]

The hon. leader of the official opposition.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, what was Canada's ranking in the climate performance index, out of 63 countries?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, I will tell members some important rankings. TD judged our green economy plan—

[The Deputy Chair, NDP, Carol Hughes]

The hon. leader of the official opposition.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, what was Canada's ranking in the climate performance index? What was our ranking?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, TD judged that our climate plan in the 2023 budget would put us at par with the United States and ahead of the rest of the world as a green economy investment destination.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, it is funny that the United States does not have a carbon tax. It is even funnier that she thinks the bankers are happy. I am sure they are happy. They do not mind paying what turns out to be 41¢ a litre when this carbon tax is fully implemented.

How much will that cap cost, net, for the average family?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, I would like the Conservatives to really look themselves in the mirror and ask if it is credible, in the 21st century, to not have a climate plan, because that is the reality of this opposition. It is a disservice to all Canadians.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, she has a tax plan and she cannot even tell us how much it will cost. We know it will be 41¢ a litre for the first carbon tax.

How much will it cost the average family in higher heat, gas and grocery bills? How much?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, as the leader of the official opposition should know, our price on pollution goes right back into the pockets of every family in Canada. It goes back into the pockets of families here in Ontario, Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba and across the country.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, the answer, according to the Parliamentary Budget Officer, is that in P.E.I., it will be $1,500. In Ontario, it will be $1,800, and in Alberta, it will be $2,700. That is just the first carbon tax. We just learned that the government plans to implement a second carbon tax, a so-called clean fuel standard.

How much will that tax add to the cost of a litre of gasoline when fully implemented? How much?

[Chrystia Freeland, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Madam Chair, I would like to remind the Conservative leader of what he and everyone sitting beside him said when they asked Canadians for their vote in the last election: “We will assess progress [so] carbon prices [can be] on a path to $170/tonne”.

Are they disavowing that?

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Madam Chair, I never supported such a thing so, of course, I do not need to disavow it.

The question was this: The minister plans a second carbon tax. How much will that tax add to the price of a litre of gas? How much?