Debates of May 2nd, 2024

National Defence

[Sherry Romanado, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the King’s Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Emergency Preparedness]

Mr. Speaker, I salute my colleague, and I thank him for his service. We worked together on the Standing Committee on National Defence.

In budget 2024, we allocated money specifically for military housing, child care and so on. Before the holidays, there were 30 hours' worth of votes in the House. Those votes included votes to increase military salaries and investments for them.

Having voted against military spending before the holidays, will he now vote in favour of the budget and military spending?

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we understand what our job as the opposition in this place is all about. We vote against the estimates or the overall budgets when they generally make no sense.

Obviously, I am always going to support helping the Canadian Forces. As I said before, I hope that can be done responsibly and, above all, effectively, to restore the pride of Canadian Forces members and, above all, to encourage young people to enlist and become proud members of the Canadian Forces.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the report we are debating called upon the government to reverse the rent increase on our forces members. While this may seem like a small thing, it just seems to be what is typical of the government's approach. The utter neglect of the forces has precipitated a crisis of recruitment and retention, yet the government has pressed ahead with the rent increase.

I wonder if the member would like to comment and connect these seemingly small things with the near-catastrophic state that our national defence is in right now.

[Pierre Paul-Hus, Conservative, Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question. As I said in my speech, military personnel are in a controlled environment. The government has complete control over the environment. Then why is it that this government decided not to increase spending on military housing for its defence team?

At some point, if rents increase, salaries have to increase. If we can maintain the environment by keeping rents the same and providing normal salary increases, it creates less pressure for everyone. That could easily have been done.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise on behalf of the women and men serving in the Canadian Armed Forces in the Ottawa valley, across Canada and abroad.

In February, the Standing Committee on National Defence passed its eighth report. The report said, “Given that, rent for Canadian military personnel living on bases is increasing this April, and at a time when the military is struggling to recruit and retain personnel, the committee report to the House, that the government immediately cancel all plans to increase rent on military accommodations used by the Department of National Defence.”

Unfortunately, for those living and serving in the CAF, the NDP-Liberal government could not be bothered to read that. April 1 came and the rent went up. Along with the higher rents, our fighting forces also had to pay the higher Liberal carbon tax.

The official policy of the Liberal Party is to make life unaffordable. While Canadians saw taxes on energy go up 23% across the country, the average rent for Canadians in uniform went up 4.2%. If the socialist coalition had its way, CAF members in Ontario would have seen a 6.8% rent hike. It was only thanks to the Ford government in Toronto putting a cap on rent increases at 2.5% that the NDP-Liberal cash grab was prevented.

The same thing happened in Nova Scotia. The radical extremist government wanted to hike rents by 9.3%. Instead, the province capped rent hikes to 5%. CAF members in Newfoundland and Labrador were not lucky enough to have a Conservative premier. Their rents went up 8.3%. In Yellowknife, rents were up by $111 a month. In Iqaluit, rents went up by $131 a month. A Bay Street lawyer renting a fancy penthouse in downtown Toronto, paying $5,000 a month, would have seen a smaller rent increase than a soldier stationed in Iqaluit. Under Chrétien and Martin, we got the feeling that Liberals were largely indifferent to the Canadian Armed Forces, but this bunch treats them with disdain.

These punishing rent hikes reveal the true ideology of the socialist coalition. It is intentionally underfunding the armed forces, driving serving members out of the military and discouraging new recruits from joining. They want to see the fighting force atrophy and eventually die, so that they can replace the military with a climate corps focused only on disaster response. Even the stuff the old Liberals used to prefer the military to focus on, such as so-called peacekeeping is now outsourced to the Communists who control China.

The latest Liberal cuts to defence budget spending are putting our women and men at risk. Normally, before being stationed abroad, our armed forces undergo combined arms training. Every unit that had been sent to Latvia as a part of Operation Reassurance had undergone combined arms training, until now. Thanks to the latest round of Liberal austerity, combined arms training has been cut. Former Liberal member of Parliament and retired general Andrew Leslie told the CBC today that cuts to military training were dangerous, saying he was “not aware of any other [NATO] army which will be deploying troops to the front line of a possible confrontation with Russia, who are not 100 per cent trained according to a variety of battle test standards.”

It is not just the army facing cuts. The far left, socialist Prime Minister is outsourcing fighter pilot training. Now the second-largest country in the world cannot even train its own fighter pilots. For anyone with a passing knowledge of Canadian history, the loss of pilot training under the socialist coalition is heartbreaking. Canada was home to the Commonwealth air training program. Between 1939 and 1945, over 130,000 pilots and aircrew from around the world were trained here in Canada. Many of those pilots fell in love with Canada or a Canadian and then came back here after the war and helped build this great nation. Few Canadians even know we once had an aircraft carrier, until it was scrapped by Pierre Trudeau. The anti-military apple does not fall far from the Marxist tree.

I almost wish the Prime Minister's military dismantling was part of a hidden agenda, but it is not. It is a very public agenda and young Canadians are paying attention. They see the news stories about higher rents for CAF members. They see the news stories about poor equipment and cuts to training. They see what the government is doing and they want no part of it. Recruitment will continue to decline because the government and the Prime Minister have done everything they can to drive it down. Fewer serving members in the CAF means less money for the defence department and more money for buying votes from special interest groups.

The recent budget reveals the government's real priorities. It plans to spend zero dollars on military housing this year and zero dollars next year, but two years from now, watch out, because it plans to spend a whopping $1 million on military housing. That is the same year these socialists have budgeted to spend over $500 billion on program expenses. Despite Liberal inflation, $1 million still sounds like a lot, but in a half-trillion dollar budget it comes out to 0.0000002%. That $1 million was not a rounding error, but that was about three zeros ago. One million dollars for military housing two years from now is an insult. Compare that to the $400 million the government plans to spend this year on housing students seeking asylum at Conestoga College. That is money the CAF could use today to make desperately needed repairs to military housing.

As the member of Parliament for the largest army base in Canada, I have seen first-hand the state of some of the housing. Asbestos, black mould, peeling paint and leaky pipes are just some of the ongoing issues on base. The government has never put that on recruiting posters. However, as bad as some units are, many soldiers will happily take whatever they can because the cost to rent off base has exploded under the Prime Minister. It used to be that a serving soldier was earning enough to buy a house, but now they have to reach the rank of general to afford buying a home.

With yesterday's confession by the Minister of National Defence the truth is out. He stated, “Trying to go to cabinet or even to Canadians and tell them that we had to do this because we need to meet this magical threshold of 2%...don't get me wrong, it's important, but it was really hard to convince people that it was a worthy goal, that it was some noble standard we had to meet.”

Recent polls have shown that a majority of Canadians support much higher defence spending. Canadians would have needed no convincing had the Minister of National Defence made the case to them, but he never tried. His description of the NATO defence pledge as a “magical threshold”, a “worthy goal” or a “noble standard” is revealing. It hardly sounds like someone who could make a persuasive case to a group of pacifists and socialists. Russia is waging a war on Ukraine. China is threatening to invade Taiwan. Iran is funding terror worldwide and launching drone attacks on Israel. Not since the Korean War has the case for increasing defence spending been more obvious, yet despite the state of the world, the NDP-Liberal government is cutting defence spending.

This is not the first time the Liberals have led the CAF into a decade of darkness, but this time it is different. Even under the Chrétien Liberals' cuts in the 1990s, Canadians were still eager to join up. Those days are gone. That is because an entire generation of Canadians have spent the last nine years hearing the Prime Minister downplay our once proud country. Why would any young person risk their lives for a post-nation state? Why sign up for a country whose own prime minister would rather apologize for?

When members of the socialist coalition look at the country all they see is a racist colonial oppressor, full of neo-Nazis hiding behind every truck trailer. They have hired an army of ideological storm troopers to lead re-education camps. They use every opportunity to erase symbols of our proud history. The truth is that the NDP-Liberal government is ashamed of Canada. Why would anyone want to serve their country when the very people running it do not like it?

It is not only that these socialists do not like Canada. They do not think much of those of us who love Canada. They do not like the kind of people who are proud to wear the uniform bearing our national flag. For the current Prime Minister, they are all just a bunch of racist misogynists and an unacceptable fringe minority. The truth is that these radical far-left Marxists across the way are the fringe minority of government.

After nine years, Canadians are tired of a Prime Minister who constantly apologizes for our country's very existence. He is just not worth the cost to our security.

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

I just want to make sure the hon. member for New Westminster—Burnaby is okay. I saw him whack his head on the back of the desk so I just want to make sure.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I did find the speech quite stimulating, but my head is fine. I hope, for the hon. member who just spoke, it is the same.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I listened very carefully to that speech. It is great the way the member for Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke does not pull punches. We all know how she feels, and I really find that refreshing in the House.

As the member said in her speech, she represents the largest base in the country. I think she would know better than anyone in this place how the housing costs affect the morale of the forces and how it is a factor in the crisis of recruitment and retention, which has been identified from the chief of the defence staff on down as the most important crisis facing the forces.

Can the member talk about this from her experience representing the people so affected by these things, such as the rent increase we are talking about?

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the increases in pay are not keeping up with the pace of increases in the cost of living, none the least of which was this recent increase in rent. They are calling me and telling me that they are having to leave the forces because they just cannot afford to live there anymore. They need a job with more pay. They would love to serve, but they cannot afford it.

[Lindsay Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member, in her speech, stated that the government will replace the Canadian Armed Forces with a climate corps.

Now, I am happy to support my PMB on the introduction of a youth climate corps, which would generate more training and job opportunities for young people in a clean energy and conservation type of economy. However, I know that the member loves conspiracy theories and that she does not necessarily believe in climate change. I cannot even count the number of times she said “socialist”, which I happen to think is a good thing, but could the member actually point to any proof she has that the creation of a youth climate corps, and this socialist plot of the government, would actually replace the Canadian Armed Forces?

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, let us get something straight from the beginning. We all know that climate change occurs. It happens over thousands of years. The member prefaced her so-called question with some false statements.

Now, I am unaware of any plans to make a youth climate corps, but where in this budget are the Liberals going find the money to do something like that when they cannot even set aside the money to keep Canadians safe and secure by funding our military?

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the member another question because there was a lot to unpack in her speech.

The condition of housing is critical as well. The member knows, from her experience representing the largest base, about the really deplorable condition of barracks and, in some cases, PMQs and residential housing units. Can she talk about what she has heard right on the ground from the forces about the condition of their living conditions, and the working conditions, because it is the buildings beyond the housing units as well.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is true that the buildings they work in sometimes have wires hanging from the ceiling. I know that the military police station has not been kept up in decades. However, there is a place that is even worse than what we have seen in some of the barracks in Petawawa, which is Shearwater. Apparently, there is black mould and peeling paint. The mattresses were so bad, and looked like they were full of lice, that they had to be pulled out before the troops could sit in there.

Now, all of this tells a potential person who is willing to put their life on the line for their country that this government does not really care about them. If it does not care about those who are signing up, training, going through the harsh conditions and putting their lives on the line, they wonder what will happen if they are injured. Is the government going to take care of them?

Insofar as the housing, there are several houses that are uninhabited because the government has not put the effort into fixing them up.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are debating the eighth report of the Standing Committee on National Defence, which addresses the rent increase that took place in April. This is what was reported back to the House: “Given that, rent for Canadian military personnel living on bases is increasing this April, and at a time when the military is struggling to recruit and retain personnel, the committee report to the House, that the government immediately cancel all plans to increase rent on military accommodations used by the Department of National Defence.”

This was something the committee agreed to unanimously. There was no dissent at committee over this point. All four parties at committee agreed that we should report this back to the House. We have now had a chance to debate this, and every member in this chamber will have a chance to vote on this. I am curious to see whether the Liberal support at committee will spill over to an expression of support in the chamber.

April 1 has come and gone, and Canadian Forces members did not get rent relief, so the housing crisis in the military continues, and the retention and recruitment crisis continues. There are 16,000 vacancies in the Canadian Armed Forces. There are 10,000 undertrained and undeployable personnel in the Canadian Armed Forces. We are in a crisis of retention and recruitment. This has been observed by the chief of the defence staff and everyone on down, who have testified at various points over the last year and a half at committee. This crisis of personnel is affecting Canada's national security. It is affecting our ability to be a meaningful ally to our partners in NATO and throughout the world.

There are a number of crises facing the forces, including the production and supply of ammunition. Troops are unable to train due to lack of equipment and supplies. We do not have enough trained forces and equipment to be able to deploy and accept deployments on behalf of allies. Increasing the rent of our soldiers on base at a time like this, when so many members are facing the cost of living crisis across the board for food and everything else, it is like we are asking the troops to tighten their belts a little more, among all of the other ways our troops are shortchanged of training opportunities and the things they joined the forces for. Our forces want to deploy. They want overseas and domestic deployments. They want to train. They do not want to go on an exercise and shout “bang” rather than actually fire training rounds. That is not what our troops want to do.

The statement that the committee reported to the House was amid reports that began in a committee of the Nova Scotia legislature. Erica Fleck, the director of emergency management for the Halifax Regional Municipality, testified, “we have active serving Regular Force members who are still couch surfing who were posted here in the Summer who cannot find a place to live. They are regularly now going to food banks.” She went on to say, “Again, I mentioned the food banks. People are coming to work hungry. Young soldiers are coming to work hungry, and leaders are trying to feed them as best they can, using their own money.” This is testimony in a provincial legislature. This is not an unverified news report or rumour that there are hungry or homeless troops.

At the same committee, Craig Hood, the executive director of Nova Scotia/Nunavut Command for the Royal Canadian Legion, testified, “What I came across was some startling information on serving members of the Canadian Armed Forces being posted here: living rough in tents, living out of their vehicles, couch surfing, engaging in interpersonal relationships for the purposes of securing housing - which oftentimes puts them as victims to domestic violence.”

This happened in December 2023, when this explosive testimony occurred in the Nova Scotia legislative committee, and what was really startling was that, when asked about this in the House of Commons, in response to a question from the member for Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman to address these allegations and to ask what was being done and why the government was failing our troops, this is what the minister had to say about that testimony: “Mr. Speaker, of course, the member opposite is once again badly misinformed. In fact, when this was reported in the press, the Canadian Armed Forces in Nova Scotia canvassed all of the members of the armed forces and determined that all of them were properly housed and that the reporting was false.”

The minister of defence actually said those words in the House of Commons. He dismissed the reports of the executive director of the Royal Canadian Legion for Nova Scotia and Nunavut Command and the director of emergency management of the Halifax Regional Municipality. He dismissed them and called their claims false. That is quite astonishing, and it was in no small part because of this that we really dug into the issue of housing in the military.

Fortunately, there are two Halifax-area MPs on the defence committee, and neither of them presumed to deny what was going on in their own city because they know. It is a fact that there is homelessness in the Canadian Armed Forces. There is food insecurity in the Canadian Armed Forces. This is the state of the armed forces under the government and the cost-of-living crisis faced by millions of Canadians that is being acutely felt in the Canadian Armed Forces.

We have been studying the crisis of housing on base, and we have had alarming testimony at the defence committee from ombudsman Lick:

I've heard from a member's dependent, who shared with me they had been homeless for five months. I've heard from families using food banks. I've also heard from some who are one paycheque away from not paying their rent or needing to make a hard decision between food and rent.

He continued, “While members do not expect a lot from their barracks, I was shocked to see some deteriorating single quarters on base that are not acceptable for any human in any situation.” This was from the military ombudsman. He also said, when he asks, “'Do you know someone who is at risk of being homeless or at risk of accessing a food bank?', everybody nods. Everybody knows someone.” This was his testimony at committee.

Amid all of this, we have a denial from the minister of defence that there is homelessness and food insecurity in the Canadian Armed Forces, so we have examined this quite thoroughly at committee, and we will have a report in due course with recommendations to Parliament, but we have found that it is not even just the residential housing units. It is the RHUs, the PMQs and barracks. We have heard of toilet facilities not up to standard by any means, mould on various walls and ceilings, and so on.

We have heard time and time again that it is things like this, such as the lack of access to a home, that drive people out of the Canadian Armed Forces at a time when we need our men and women so much. At a time of elevated need, we have a crisis of retention and recruitment.

In response to an Order Paper question that I had asked, we have confirmation that recruitment is not keeping up with people leaving the forces. We have 16,000 vacancies and 10,000 people undertrained, and the forces are shrinking. It is getting worse, not better.

We have seen the shortages and how the wait-lists of personnel to obtain a home are sometimes longer than the postings. When members of the CAF have to re-post from one end of the country to another, this is a trigger point. This is where military families have to decide whether they can continue in the forces or not. If personnel have to transfer from Halifax to Esquimalt, maybe they own a home in Halifax already or maybe they have access to a residential housing unit that is not terrible, that is not falling apart and that has a working toilet, and they would be going to another posting where they might be on a waiting list for five years. Then they would have to go on the market and find a place to rent or buy in an expensive place like Esquimalt.

Every place is an expensive place in Canada after nine years of the Liberal government. In nine years of the government, we have seen rents double, as an average, across the country, more than double and almost triple in some large cities. We have seen the price of housing across the country double. Interest rates are high and are being fuelled by deficits, which trigger inflation, which triggers higher interest rates. We have seen no restraint from the government. We have seen no balance and no ability to rein in or do anything about the crisis of housing and access to housing across Canada.

When it comes to our armed forces, the least the government could do is not boost up the rent on the small group of people who are fortunate enough to even have a base house, never mind the plight of forces members who are on multi-year waiting lists. There are thousands of CAF members waiting for access to base housing.

We have actually called upon the housing minister to come to committee, housing being one of the triggers that are causing people to leave the forces and presumably a factor in the difficulty of the forces to recruit. The minister has not come to committee to answer for this.

We note that the budget the Liberals just tabled contains exactly zero dollars for additional housing on base. There is zero dollars next year, too. There is $1 million the year after that, if I remember correctly. As far out as we can see, in the budget projections through to 2029, I think there is eventually a total of some $14 million for military housing. They are short thousands of units. How are they going to fix this problem without budgeting for it? The government is not even going to start to address the backlog and the shortfall in construction for base housing, not with zero dollars this year and zero dollars next year.

Under the existing funding, they are building about 20 homes a year. Let us think about that. There are thousands of people waiting for a home, and 20 homes a year are being built. They are decommissioning close to that number anyway. They are barely keeping up with the ones that have fallen apart to the point that they cannot even be used anymore. These properties, as we have seen from testimony, are pretty rough to begin with.

There is also nothing to address this issue in the defence policy update that was just tabled. In fact, it is a misnomer to even call it a defence policy update. It is full of exploring options and reaffirming existing policies. There is literally nothing concrete that is new policy, unless it was formerly the policy not to consider options.

This is assuming the Liberals were ever going to consider options to replace our submarines. undertake and see through NORAD modernization, or build and procure any of the kit we need. Unless it was the Liberals' policy not to consider options before, a new policy of considering options is hardly a policy.

Taking it back to housing, there is nothing in there respecting housing. This seems to be such a small thing. I have heard the Liberals ask, “do the Conservatives not know the rents are capped at 25% of the forces member's salary?” This is capped, so they can afford it. However, their wages are not keeping up with the rest of the cost of living increases. The military members' budgets are already stretched, so now even any increase is going to reduce the standard of living for that family.

We have heard time and again that it is all these other factors that drive people out of the forces. It is the difficulty with repostings and the way that affects families if they are established in a community. They may already have a family doctor in a community and kids in school, and the serving member's spouse has employment, and then they are told they have to be reposted across Canada. Maybe the spouse's job is not transferrable. Maybe their credentials are not recognized in another jurisdiction. Maybe they are going to be waiting five years to find a doctor in that community and, oh, by the way, they cannot afford a home there. They may lose the base housing if it is a family in a PMQ and would not receive the same accommodation in the new post. These are all factors that affect retention and recruitment.

The government has a crisis of retention and recruitment. The forces are, in the words of the defence minister, in a death spiral of crises of retention and recruitment. Why not do the easiest thing that the Liberals could have done, even if it is only symbolic? It is by no means suddenly meeting the 2% of GDP obligation that we have to our allies, but it would be something. It would send a signal to the troops that they do not bear the cost of the $950 million of cuts that are taking place and that the Liberals announced.

I have said enough on this for now. I will take any questions.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for advocating for military veterans and their families. It is greatly appreciated.

I want to go back to 2015. I recall knocking on doors and meeting military personnel living in the Comox Valley in my riding, and they could not find housing. People were struggling then.

It takes long-out planning and thought, and the Liberals have failed to do that. They inherited a failed plan or no plan, if one wants to call it that, when it comes to housing for military personnel.

Does my colleague regret that his government did not put more foresight into building housing units for military personnel? What would he do differently, moving forward, so that we could honour those people who are serving our country?

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I will say that the government does not have a monopoly on non-investment in the forces. That is not to say I agree with the premise of his question. I would go back to a previous Liberal government. We had a decade of darkness. We had the Prime Minister's father, who decimated the military and really even firmly withdrew us from the orbit of the western defence system. If we want to keep going back in time, I guess we can, but I am going to focus on the government that is here.

I came here in 2015 when the current government was elected, and it has systematically ignored national defence and national security. It is about time that we had a government that takes these things seriously, becomes a meaningful and willing ally to our alliance, takes our national defence seriously and stands by our troops.

[Sherry Romanado, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the King’s Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Emergency Preparedness]

Mr. Speaker, interestingly enough, the member and I have not had the chance to work together. We were elected the same year, but we have not had a chance to work together. I would like to thank him for the work he is doing on the national defence committee.

I wanted to talk to him about postings. He did talk about postings and the difficulties with respect to finding homes for our military families when they move every two or three years, depending on where they are being posted. I think the member knows I have two children serving in the Canadian Armed Forces, so I know very well the challenges that families face. He mentioned there was no money in the budget for military housing. Page 307 does have information with respect to the commitment made.

Could the member give us an example of something he heard during the study on maybe extending the length of time for postings? Rather than having a posting every two or three years, maybe that could be expanded to five or six years, instead of having to move around so frequently. I am not sure if that is something he heard during the study.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we have heard that in multiple studies that we have undertaken. Any time we are talking about factors that affect morale, recruitment and retention, that comes up. It has always been thus, but with the cost of living being what it is, many people are rooted in a community in a way that earlier generations were not, because of connections to employment that do not transfer very well or housing. If somebody bought a house 10 years ago in one community and then gets re-posted across the country, that creates a significant hardship. Yes, I think there is a lot of awareness at the committee, if that is what the member is asking.

I do not have a copy of the budget with me, but if the member is referring to the chart that I am thinking of, it is zero dollars this year, zero dollars next year, $1 million the year after that, and $14 million by 2029. That is not going to build enough houses to make even a dent in the backlog in housing.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Mr. Speaker, picking up on the point made by the member for Calgary Rocky Ridge, about 4,500 units need to be built to house the men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces on bases across Canada.

We saw the government deliver its latest budget, which provides $61 billion in unfunded deficit spending, yet when it comes to investing in housing for the men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces for this coming year, the government is providing a big fat zero, a big fat zero the following year, and then a mere $1 million in the third year.

What does that say about the government's priorities when it comes to its lack of support for the men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces?

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I think it says everything about priorities. We have had testimony at the defence committee from the chief of the defence staff and others who have clearly stated that we are perhaps in the most dangerous times since the Second World War, in the words of the chief of the defence staff.

However, there is dithering over all of these critically needed changes that have to be made, like critical procurements. They seem to be problems one would think we could solve, like ammunition production, yet we dither away. We produce fewer artillery shells in a month than the Ukrainian army fires by lunchtime. It desperately needs these supplies. We do not even have enough to ramp it up and replace and fully stock our own supplies, never mind being a meaningful exporter to allies who also need this kind of kit.

We have production issues, and we have the retention and recruitment crisis. There is no commitment from the government. The defence minister himself has said that his own cabinet colleagues shrugged their shoulders and did not listen to his plea for more money. We are under an obligation within our alliance to spend 2% of our GDP. That is a minimum commitment within the alliance that underpins Canada's security, and there is no plan to get there.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I asked earlier and I just want an answer. What would the Conservatives do in terms of offering a plan?

We want to work with the Conservatives on this to ensure that we build housing for military personnel and their families and, of course, for those who have served, our veterans, whom we are always indebted to for the remainder of their lives. Does my colleague suggest an idea or a plan that he would like to present or discuss in the House that we could possibly work together on?

We would like to see public lands kept in public hands. Those public lands should absolutely be prioritized for military personnel, veterans and indigenous peoples. Does my colleague agree with that?

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the member will have to wait for our platform. I am in no position to launch it today, nor do I have a plan to table. This is not the place for it.

There is a commitment from our party, from our leader, to finally take defence seriously. There will be a plan tabled to ensure that the men and women in our forces get the respect they need, get access to the housing they need and get the kit and equipment they need for training opportunities and to be ready to deploy if necessary.

[Fraser Tolmie, Conservative, Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK]

Mr. Speaker, as we gather here in the House, I would like to take the opportunity to paint a picture of the issue brought forth by the Conservative shadow minister for national defence concerning the recent rent increase in military housing.

Imagine a brave active military member serving at the arms depot in Dundurn or at 15 Wing air base in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. Military members serve this country proudly and have faith that the government is working cohesively to fight the affordability crisis. Just with that thought, their military housing rent goes up, along with the carbon tax.

I am disappointed that we need to have this debate today. Military housing in an opportunity for serving members to be able to afford a place to live despite their salaries being too low and the cost of living being too high. We, as a government, should be prepared to provide them accommodations that reflect their sacrifices.

The cost of living crisis is hurting everyone, and the brave people who serve in our Canadian Armed Forces are no exception. It is a fact that the high cost of living has brought stress upon Canadians above all other issues, and our brave men and women are not exempt from this. We need to be more mindful of the negative impacts this stress can have on their work, thereby impacting the security of our country. We need to look at this from a holistic point of view and understand the required synergies, or basic needs, for our military personnel to function best.

Sitting on the veterans affairs committee, I have heard far too many stories about our heroes, who are serving or have served, struggling to get by and often ignored by the government, which says they are asking for too much. This is certainly not a good reflection at all and does not create an incentive for people to join the military, especially at a time when recruitment is facing record lows that are dangerous to the sustainability of defending our nation. It has been noted as a death spiral.

Instead of retaining the fighter training program here in Canada, the Liberal government recently exported our fighter pilot training program to some of our allies. This affects Moose Jaw and Cold Lake. The government has sent our military members to Italy, Finland, Australia and the U.S.

The government has added insult to injury, where we have lost training placements that are normally reserved for Canadians in the NATO jet training program down in the U.S. This is seriously reducing the capability of training our front line fighter pilots to defend our borders, leaving our northern airspace vulnerable.

Whether one is serving or has served, it is clear that the Liberal government has ignored the importance of putting personnel first.

Earlier this week, a veterans advocate spoke to our committee, sharing her thoughts on veterans homelessness. Rima Aristocrat said, “I cannot find any excuse, and I believe each and every one of you will say the same. There is no excuse. For somebody who gives us the life we have here, liberty and freedom we are so proud of. It did not come by itself. That took a lot of sacrifice, people's sacrifice.... Their families are unsung heroes. They sacrificed so much with them. And what do we do? Once a year we say thank you to them.... How about the rest of the time when they cannot afford to pay rent? How about the time when they cannot feed or clothe their children? How about the time we have to pick up homeless veterans from the street freezing there? There's no excuse for it. Our country is too great. We are too powerful. We are too kind to let this happen”.

Ms. Aristocrat, along with others, recognize the financial desperation our military members and veterans are experiencing. It is a truly heartbreaking situation when those who fought for our country and saw their friends and comrades make the ultimate sacrifice are left behind or are unable to get by. Today, we are talking about how those who are currently serving are being squeezed.

I was shocked to see that, on April 1, the 100th anniversary of the Royal Canadian Air Force, a day which we should be celebrating, not only did the government hike its inflationary carbon tax, but it also raised the rent for our military personnel. What kind of thanks for their service is that?

Recently, the military ombudsman appeared at the national defence committee talking about this issue. He said that it would be “tone deaf” for the government to increase rent on the Canadian Armed Forces at a time when we hear of them struggling to find proper accommodations and make ends meet. However, that is exactly what we have come to expect from the current government: tone-deaf policies.

Liberals see people struggling to feed and house their families and decide that they still need to raise the carbon tax. Only when their east coast members' seats are in jeopardy do they decide to provide a small bit of relief from this tax grab. I am sure those residents are happy, but when Saskatchewan argues that the same policy should be fairly applied to all Canadians, the Prime Minister decides to have the province audited by the CRA. Again, we have tone-deaf policies from the government.

Our military personnel in Dundurn, Moose Jaw, and those serving coast to coast to coast should have all the possible support they need to keep our country safe and prosperous. We are too kind a nation to allow the military members I mentioned before, who are fighting for their country bravely, to suffer alone in this housing crisis and be seen as another source of an increase in revenue for the government rather than a vital part of our country's defence.

The Liberal government's track record, whether it is national defence, supporting our veterans or building homes, is a complete failure. Liberal promises are like unicorns. They are not real; they are just fairy tales. Once again, I urge the government to come back to the real world, to wake up, to do what is right and to roll back this rent increase to ease the cost of living crisis for those brave people who put their lives at risk for us.

In closing, I would like to take a quick moment to thank a young lady, Lora Laleva, who helped me write this speech. She is a young lady who believes in this country. She was sitting in this gallery earlier today and sat in the gallery all day yesterday, listening to our democratic process. I met with her, brought her to the office and said, “I want to see what you are capable of.” That young lady is going to be a future leader in this country, and we need to provide an opportunity for people like her to live in a prosperous nation.

It is time to axe the tax. It is time to roll back the rent increase on our military personnel. It is time to send the right message to the people of this great nation that we live in that there is hope and opportunity for the next generation.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for his service to our country as an officer in the Canadian Air Force. His office is right across the hall from mine, so we spend a lot of time together, and I appreciate his work.

We know that no veteran should be living on the street. Someone who has served our country should not be homeless. We know that 67% of homeless people in my community of Port Alberni are indigenous. As my colleague from Churchill—Keewatinook Aski just raised, even if we were to double indigenous housing right now there would still not be enough housing to house indigenous people. That is absolutely shameful in a country like ours.

I have talked about, and the government talks about this in its budget, using public lands, but they have to be in public hands. It should prioritize military personnel, veterans and indigenous peoples.

I asked this question earlier, and a Conservative colleague said Conservatives were waiting until their platform gets rolled out in the next election. I get stuff done here all the time. I am not waiting for the next election to get things done. I think we can work together now. I do not think we can wait until an election next year.

I am putting my hand out and extending an olive branch to my colleague in the hope that he will work with me to put pressure on the government to do the right thing when it comes to public lands and getting our priorities in order. Will my colleague accept that olive branch instead of waiting until an election is called?

[Fraser Tolmie, Conservative, Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to acknowledge my colleague from across the hallway. We have had some great chats walking to our offices. I do not think we have ever shared a coffee or a donut, but that could happen.

I was thinking about the question the member posed to my colleague earlier on. One thing I have noticed is that there is a cyclical problem that happens. What happens is this: A Liberal government comes into power and creates a problem. It reduces the money spent on the military. Then Conservatives come along and invest, but it takes a long time to dig ourselves out of the hole it has put us into.

I would ask my colleague to recognize that Conservatives have always put the military first, that we care about those personnel and that we care about the defence of our country. When in power, we would deliver on the promises we are making right now.