Ethel Blondin-Andrew

[Social Security Programs, October 6th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I am glad the hon. member took the opportunity to ask a question. She makes remarks about the unemployment insurance changes proposed and also about family income and support.

Those are subjects for debate and consultation. Those are matters on which we are asking the public to give us their views. We are engaging in a public process. I am sure she has her own specific views.

I would like to allow the public to make up its mind. I will be dealing, as I indicated, with aboriginal women, friendship centres, the four national aboriginal groups, northerners, Canadians from all parts of the country. I will be meeting with people in Kamloops tomorrow. I will be listening, as should the other parties be listening to the public.

I mentioned in my speech this is not prescriptive. We are not going to tell people what it should be. We want to ask them for their responses to the proposals we have put out there.

[Social Security Programs, October 6th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, investing in people is the government's number one priority in this exercise of social security review. It is stated:

In the economy of the 1990s, it is information and knowledge-based industries that are providing the foundation for jobs and economic growth. Canadians must have the skills, opportunities, and knowledge to meet the demands of the new job market.

This is directly from the red book. By Canadians we mean all Canadians: aboriginal peoples fighting against the odds; youth making the transition from school to the workforce; sole parents balancing family and employment needs; women and their children struggling; and Canadians who find themselves in transition between jobs, some for short periods but many and frequently for too long are displaced out of their jobs; and displaced older workers looking for hope in the form of a new opportunity, perhaps a new job. These are the Canadians we promised to help in the red book.

These goals have not changed and we are now looking at how best to achieve them. The discussion paper released yesterday gives Canadians a chance to debate what is necessary, what is possible with the resources available to us. Our government has identified employability as a fundamental goal of social programming. As the National Anti-Poverty Organization has correctly noted, the best social security for an individual is a decent job paying decent wages.

The response has been swift to the document tabled. I must say I have had the opportunity to meet with some good people this very day and over the last day or so who have responded. I met this morning, for instance, with Jonathan Murphy of the Social Planning Council of Edmonton. I quote what he said:

We are supportive of the emphasis on training and breaking the cycle of unemployment. There are 40,000 children in Edmonton growing up in poverty. The extended child benefit program will help them. We must maintain national standards for a social safety net. We have a real fear of separate agendas which would undermine national goals for Canadians.

These are the expressions of people. I have also had the opportunity to meet with the aboriginal leaders because we are engaging in and embarking on a process for the aboriginal people by which they will participate. We are working hard to achieve a process they all agree to.

Having said that, we now know that technological change has altered the look of a decent job beyond recognition. Consider the future that lies before a young woman of 18. Perhaps she is just starting a community college program this year. Can anyone predict the skills she will need in the workplace of the year 2030? Of course not. What we can predict is that her education will not end when she graduates from college. She will need to keep learning. In fact the means to social security is not simply a job today; it is the ability to get a job at any one point in anyone's life. That depends on developing and enhancing skills all through life.

Let me go to what the leader of our country has to say on the whole issue. In Quebec City on September 18 the Prime Minister outlined four key components of the government's job and growth agenda. Quite clearly we cannot operate in isolation on any massive reform and expect to have the answers to all the questions. However, listen to this. The first is reforming social security. The second is ensuring a healthy fiscal climate. The third is reviewing government programs and priorities. These sound like some of the things the government is undertaking, quite clearly. The fourth is strengthening the performance of the Canadian economy in investment, innovation and trade.

Members should know that the Prime Minister is embarking on a trade mission to China with a delegation. These are things he has stated and these are things we are living up to on a daily basis. We are working hard to draw in the support and confidence of all Canadians.

Not only are we undertaking government programs, services, and reviews of policies, programs and services, but we are essentially appealing to the public to build the confidence, the trust, to ensure that we do not engage in empty evangelism, that we do not create false hope and that we are in fact doing things that will result in substantive moves for people to improve the quality of their lives.

With the time available to me in the debate today I want to focus on how large a part of social security reform evolves around learning for children, for youth, for adults; learning in our cities, towns and most isolated communities; learning for everyone; and learning for life.

Everyone here understands that learning is the key to employability. The willingness to work hard no longer guarantees a job. The fact that a person has an education is no longer a guarantee, but it is better than having nothing which guarantees nothing, almost for sure, no opportunities. Competition from other countries and automation have ensured that the new jobs in our economy demand a higher and broader set of skills. People who stop their education early limit their employability. People who keep learning improve it.

Since the second world war federal contributions have helped build and operate an extensive and accessible system of post-secondary education. This government has continued those efforts.

In April we launched our youth employment and learning strategy. One element of the strategy was a series of improvements to student aid. How did we improve the Canada student loans program? It was, first, by increasing the weekly loan limits for full time students by 57 per cent; by raising the ceiling on loans for part time students to $4,000; and by creating opportunities, special opportunities grants that will provide an extra $3,000 to single parents pursuing their studies part time.

For students with disabilities and women in Ph.D. programs we will be offering a national program of deferred grants for the first time that will help high need students who would otherwise face extremely high debt loads on graduation. At the same time we realize that the educational status quo has problems.

The traditional distinctions between community colleges and universities tend to raise barriers that may no longer be relevant. We need to examine the way in which learning is structured and the support available.

Having mentioned the status quo, I cannot emphasize enough that we know the status quo is not an option, that things cannot remain the same. Whatever our political stripe, whatever our concern or constituencies, we know as a country that we have an obligation to look at change. We have to be able to change things so that every Canadian who is drawn into the debate and every Canadian who benefits from the debate will know that we have done the right thing by not burying our heads in the sand and turning away from the greatest opportunity to have courage to change for the country, to change for the people, to change for poor children, to change for the people who are unemployed cyclically, to change for the people on intergenerational unemployment insurance, intergenerational poverty laden with social assistance. It is a very difficult situation.

We cannot avoid the opportunity to have the courage and the vision to engage in a debate in earnest with no hidden agendas, with no weasel words or sneakiness, to go out there and ask the people and consult with them; not to prescribe, not to come in with an ironclad and iron fisted approach that says this is our way and this is the way we are going to do it. The way we want to engage in this debate is to be honest and open and to appeal to the public to recognize that there has to be an opportunity to make a difference with their consensus and with their consultation.

We have received a great many letters from people who have told us just how difficult the idea of turning lifelong learning into reality can be. For many, of course, the issue is money. The discussion paper offers ideas to fund post-secondary education. It considers the method of improving access for people who want to upgrade their skills. It recognizes that we have a role in supporting post-secondary education. We must continue to do so.

The discussion paper recognizes that the federal government provides core funding for the post-secondary system through tax points. As members will recall the budget earlier this year called for the federal government to reduce cash transfers. We have already told the provinces and territories that funding for post-secondary education will return to the level of $2.1 billion in 1996 and 1997. It might best serve the public to know what we spend money on.

Quite clearly federal expenditures on social security programs should be stated as such. We spend a total of $38.7 billion. We spend $12.4 billion on UI regular benefits. For UI developmental uses we spend $1.9 billion. Employment programs, the consolidated revenue fund has $1.4 billion. For vocational rehabilitation for disabled persons we spend $0.2 billion. Child tax benefits, $5.1 billion. The Canada assistance plan yields $8.2 billion. Canada student loans $0.5 billion. Post-secondary education, established programs financing, $6.1 billion. UI administration $1.2 billion. UI maternity, parental adoption and sickness benefits $1.7 billion. This of course does not include seniors. The review we are talking about excludes a whole section.

Something else the public might find extremely interesting is that under the social assistance to heads of households we have a listing of percentages. Those people who are unemployed but are employable, who would work if there was the opportunity, are 45 per cent. Lone parents constitute 28 per cent. Disabled 20 per cent and others 7 per cent. These are statistics that I think people need to be aware of in dealing with the whole issue of reform. People want to know where the money is going and what it is being spent on.

One thing we should also make the public very aware of is very clearly and simply the objectives for the reform stated clearly here in this document. The first is jobs, helping Canadians get and keep work by ensuring that they have the knowledge and skills to compete with the best labour forces in the world, support for those most vulnerable, those who feel that we are undertaking this reform on the backs of the poor.

Hear me now. In this document it is stated that we would provide support for those most vulnerable. That of course includes the poor. Providing income support for those in need while fostering independence, self-confidence and initiatives

and starting to tackle child poverty. Affordability cannot be avoided. Making sure that the social security system is within our means and more efficiently managed with a real commitment to end waste and abuse. This quite clearly addresses some of the concerns that have been stated to date. It has not been long but we have had some response.

How can we make the best use of this money? Broadening student access and the whole issue of learning. Broadening student access is the best way. Tuition fees by the provinces and territories have moved the cost of education back to the students.

The paper offers an interesting option, end the cash transfer for institutional support quickly and expand student loan opportunities instead. We estimate that a $500 million student aid program would make accessible $2 billion in loans every year. The target for that money could be older students who want to add to their skills and people who want to retrain as well. There are other options to help finance their education. For example, another idea that is being tossed about is using the moneys accumulated in registered retirement savings plans. Another option is the income contingent repayment plan.

Many of us have heard from constituents who have graduated but who are having a difficult time repaying their student loans. People are not reluctant to contribute to their own well-being, to their own promotion and their own development. However, they want to engage in a process that will be simpler, more equitable, fairer and more reasonable. We agree with that. We think that there is a way that can be done and we want to hear from people about that. If they have found work it may not pay well enough initially to make ends meet. That is a major concern.

Income contingent repayment works well in Australia and New Zealand. It permits people to repay their loans on the basis of their incomes. They also permit the use of limited public funds to meet emerging priorities. Partnerships with the federal government and the private sector are key to this approach. These options improve employability on the base of a shared responsibility and shared contribution.

I understand that the time for debate is not as long as we would all like so I am going to skip over to some of the things that I feel are really essential. As I indicated earlier, we are looking at engaging in a process with the aboriginal First Nations group. We need to establish a process that we all agree to. We continue to do that but I think something that we really need to emphasize is the role that my constituents play.

I, like any other member in the House, have a constituency, the Northwest Territories. We have a post-secondary education system of learning called Arctic College. If you ever want to tour the college campus you will have to bring your mukluks or your sneakers, Mr. Speaker, because the campus is three million square kilometres. It is spread throughout the north. My hon. colleague, the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development, knows only too well how difficult and how long it takes to traverse and how inclement the conditions can be up there.

That brings me to the reason for this reform. I have had the opportunity to discuss with the aboriginal peoples. Each of these objectives, as I stated initially, is going to meet the needs and priorities of aboriginal people if we have a process that they can engage in. Aboriginal peoples want education and training opportunities like all Canadians. As the situation stands now, the aboriginal unemployment rate is approximately twice the Canadian average rate. Almost half of all aboriginal adults have incomes of less than $10,000.

According to the 1990 aboriginal peoples surveyed, the social assistance dependency rate for registered Indians on reserve was over 41 per cent. The dependency rate for registered Indians off reserve was 57 per cent. The dependency rate for the population as a whole for Canadians other than aboriginal populations was only 7 per cent.

The aboriginal population is very young. Its birth rate is twice the Canadian average. Among the Inuit 43 per cent are under 15 years old. In recent years strides have been made in improving education for this young population. The good news is that we have resolved to do something about the problems that we have. There are many partnerships being forged and many efforts being undertaken by First Nations themselves. The number of status Indians enrolled in post-secondary education institutions nearly doubled in the five years between 1986 and 1991. This is an overall increase of approximately 22,000 students who are currently in post-secondary education, according to my colleague, the minister of Indian and northern affairs. That is something that we are all proud of and we all want to continue to make work effectively.

The enrolment of on-reserve children in kindergarten, elementary and secondary schools has increased from 72 per cent of school age children in 1960-61 to 91 per cent in 1990-91. The federal government's head start program will also create a unique opportunity. We will see the positive results as healthier, stronger and more confident aboriginal children entering their school years. However, much remains to be done.

No segment of the Canadian population faces a more glaring need for effective social policy measures, enhanced opportunities, reducing barriers, investing in people, addressing specific individual and community needs than does the aboriginal population.

The government has taken a number of steps to assist in developing and assessing the implications of social security reform for aboriginal peoples. The objective is to establish an inclusive approach in consultation an in co-ordination with aboriginal peoples.

We will be participating and ensuring-myself specifically, along with the minister and the government-meaningful aboriginal involvement in the social security reform process in the upcoming months. Social security reform can provide aboriginal peoples with a unique opportunity to foster effective delivery of social services that will have an immediate impact on their communities.

The governments of Canada and the Northwest Territories for instance have launched a strategic initiative to help social assistance recipients. Investing in people will provide them with counselling, career and employment development, life skills, on the job experience and education.

By creating opportunities and reducing dependency, we can work toward building upon the hope and promise of Canada's youth, both within and outside the aboriginal communities. I commend the Government of the Northwest Territories for the steps they are taking to help northerners to better themselves. They have undertaken their own track and I am sure they will integrate their views into this.

I would like to conclude by saying that this is not just about one Canadian, one organization, one special interest group. This is about the direction in which our country will go. This is about the way we want to see the quality of life affected for every child in this country. This is about the way that we as a a government want to reinvent the direction in which government goes to serve the public, to serve every Canadian.

This is the way we want to balance those elements we have all talked about from all sides of the House. It is about jobs, about affordability and about vulnerability, not to avoid the people who most need our help, but to provide reform for all of our country and for every Canadian. We welcome their participation.

[Child Poverty, September 29th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to have the opportunity to debate this very important motion presented by the hon. member.

Child poverty is on the minds of many Canadians. We know from surveys that 91 per cent of Canadians make the reduction of child poverty a major priority. Considering the enormous riches we have in the country, there is no excuse whatsoever for Canada to have so many children living in poverty.

Estimates vary as to the number, but a commonly cited statistic is 1.25 million children live in low income families. Clearly this is not acceptable. There are those who believe that poor children is not an isolated issue, but that poor children come from poor families, poor parents. It is a complex issue that we can appreciate only too well.

This is not a simple matter. Child poverty is more than a little boy or little girl going without adequate nutrition or warm clothing for school. Yes, it is that. But it is so much more. Child poverty can stem from family breakdown, or a parent or parents not having a job, or not having a job that pays a decent wage.

What do we need to do? We need to work together with our partners in the provinces and the non-governmental organizations to come up with constructive solutions that will address the underlying cause of child poverty. Let us do it right. Let us work in a co-operative, constructive way. Let us take the necessary steps to make a real difference in alleviating the plight of so many Canadian children.

I extend an open invitation to hon. members and to all of our partners to contribute their input. That to me is what social security reform is all about. It is not about whose toes are being stepped on or how the status quo is going to be affected. No, it is about finding real solutions for real people and real problems.

Let us explore a broad range of ideas and then zero in on the most effective measures to prevent children from falling into poverty in the first place rather than always reacting to the situation once it is there.

Let me assure you however, Mr. Speaker, that the federal government is already contributing to the welfare of Canadian children through a number of initiatives. For example, in 1994-95 under the child tax benefit program we will provide $1.6 billion to families with incomes below $30,000. Under the Canada assistance plan the federal government will provide to the provinces and territories some $1.3 billion for welfare payments, $315 million for child care and $440 million for child welfare.

In the red book document the government outlined a commitment of $720 million over three years to expand the availability of quality child care. Last February the budget set aside money for the first two years of this initiative.

We will have to develop a consensus in co-operation with our provincial partners and parents across the country about how that money should be spent. Discussions on child care have already begun with provincial and territorial governments but invest we must because our investment in children is an investment in our future.

I am pleased to say that the Department of Human Resources Development is also working with the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development to improve child care for First Nations children living on reserves. As a government we also have the initiative of the head start program that is being headed up by the Department of Health.

Hon. colleagues know that I have a special empathy and so do they for aboriginal children and the appalling conditions that they face daily. I am reminded of a 1990 report by the National Youth in Care Network. It is estimated that of the more than 303,000 children 17 years of age and under, 51 per cent of status aboriginals and 27 per cent of the Metis children live in poverty.

It is no wonder that we have tremendous child poverty in aboriginal communities. On average aboriginal income is about one-half to one-third less than for other Canadians as a whole. This is a statistic that has been used quite often in different efforts to create equity.

Both the unemployment level and the level of illiteracy is twice that of the Canadian population. Aboriginal students are only one-half as likely to receive a post-secondary education as are Canadians generally. There are significantly fewer aboriginal students who complete high school. In some northern communities as few as 5 per cent of aboriginal youth complete grade 12.

This situation which we should be especially ashamed of cries out for our immediate attention. The Canadian Council on Social Development reminded us last week that while we focus on social security reform to make our programs more effective we need to also look at the labour market and how it can supply good paying jobs.

Of course, it all ties together. I am sure hon. members will agree that child poverty is linked to education and employment.

I heard my hon. colleague refer to the fact that there are educated people, heads of households with degrees, who live in poverty and their families that live in poverty. We realize as a government in terms of education and life-long learning that it is not that they learned something, that they have certain skills and certain talents, but that their skills are matched to opportunities.

We have to approach the whole issue of learning with a difference. Not only will we be challenged with making tougher choices, but we will also be guiding people to make the right choices, better choices and smarter choices for their employment and other opportunities.

In 1993 there was a 17 per cent increase in jobs for students with post-secondary education. There was no growth for those with only secondary education. There was a 17 per cent decline in jobs for students with less than secondary education.

The Canada Council report says that children from poor families are more than twice as likely to be school dropouts. Let us face it, the better educated and the better trained a person is on the whole, the better chance he or she has of landing a well paying job.

Last spring the Minister of Human Resources Development and I collaborated with provincial and business partners to implement an employment and learning strategy for Canadian youth. The strategy for which we have budgeted $684.5 million in the current fiscal year is helping our young people in the difficult transition from school to work. It is addressing barriers such as high school dropout rates, access to post-secondary education, lack of work experience and effective job training.

Youth Services Canada is one of the strategic measures aimed at putting unemployed and out of school young people back to work. The mission of Youth Services Canada is to strengthen young people's sense of accomplishment, self-reliance and self-esteem and to enable young people to gain meaningful work experience.

I point out that the majority of the program funds will go directly to youths and that eligible participants will receive financial assistance to help them pay for day care while they are working.

As we reform our social security programs the whole employment and learning strategy will help to ensure that young people, the future leaders, the future builders of this great nation, will have every chance to become productive and self-reliant.

This is the thrust of social security reform. It is a springboard, not a cushion that robs people of initiative and self-esteem. It is an effort to reintegrate, to pick people up and to help them to reintegrate into the mainstream, not to marginalize them and not to create dependency.

Another aspect right now of the 1.25 million children living in low income families is that over 40 per cent live in single parent families headed by women. In the Northwest Territories in 1991 the average income for single parent families was $17,100. Someone familiar with the politics and the economic demographics and otherwise of the country will know that the cost of living in the Northwest Territories has been stated as 30 per cent to 40 per cent higher than that of southern communities. North of 60 there is a real difference in the cost of living, not to mention the lack of infrastructure and the lack of opportunities for employment. There are situations that are quite limiting so we are definitely at a disadvantage.

We need to do much more to help sole parents, mostly of course single mothers, by providing more quality affordable child care services. Helping these sole parents become self-supporting will go a long way toward alleviating child poverty.

One example of building self-reliance is a project announced by the government on September 16 in Rimouski, Quebec. For 27 weeks beginning the middle of next month the government and its partners in the Rimouski region will give women with no income access to a training program that will enable them to enter the labour market by creating their own businesses. This is an empowering process. These women entrepreneurs have sound business ideas but they have no income to launch their businesses. By training them, by enabling them to attain specific skills, we are helping them to get their businesses off the ground.

Human resources development is supporting the initiative in Rimouski. Each participant will receive financial assistance in the form of weekly allowances, which includes child care costs for those who require them. We know it is very limiting when individuals are faced with extra hours either to learn or to perform their duties on the job and are not provided with any kind of assistance.

Three weeks ago in Winnipeg the government signed an agreement with the Government of Manitoba to assist 4,000 single parents currently on welfare. It is called "Taking Charge". This five-year project will give single parents access to a storefront office where they will receive help with needs ranging from child care training to family support to job placement.

I conclude by saying that I hope we will not hear complaints and cynicism that nothing can be done. If we work together we can do a great deal. There is plenty of optimism among Canadians. Let us tap into that hope and develop a social security system to serve Canadians in the 1990s and for decades to come. Poor people are not poor by choice; they are poor because of circumstances.

I appeal to all my colleagues to have a heart for the poor children of Canada. They are not poor by choice; they are the victims of circumstances. We have to work to alleviate those circumstances and set the record straight for those people to have a better future in our country.

[Pulp And Paper Industry, June 22nd, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I share my hon. colleague's assessment of the critical importance of this industry which currently employs more than 72,000 Canadians and sustains the economy of countless rural communities across Canada.

The Minister of Human Resources Development, his cabinet colleagues and I are now in the process of reviewing this report which was commissioned by HRD. Certainly the report's key recommendation for more training is very consistent with the minister's strong commitment to building an active labour force.

Let me assure this House that we as a government will work in close collaboration with all partners to find innovative initiatives which will support and revitalize this industry and the affected communities.

[Young Offenders Act, June 16th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, I believe there is equal application of the law for young offenders. Because of the rate of recidivism and the higher rates of incarceration for aboriginal people generally, as I indicated, the rate of incarceration exceeds the population for men in particular. I am not sure that pertains to young offenders but I would venture it would be very close.

Having said that, I do not think there is any special treatment. If there is any special treatment it is to create equality not to create inequality. There are such inconsistencies and such marginalization right now that there is definitely a constitutional disadvantage applied to young aboriginal people.

[Young Offenders Act, June 16th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, this whole issue of young offenders is not an either/or. We are attempting to create a balance within the justice system, especially as it pertains to young offenders.

We are looking at some rehabilitative measures. We are not going to lock up young people and throw away the key. We know that the costs for incarceration are prohibitive.

I know that because in my riding, and the hon. member for Kenora-Rainy River can attest to it, we had the highest rate of recidivism, of repeaters. We know what it costs to keep people incarcerated for long periods of time. The upkeep costs are prohibitive. The Minister of Justice and other members are attempting to create a balance to address the issues of violent

crimes committed by young offenders and still maintain a section for rehabilitation.

As I indicated, the Department of Justice is not the only department that has that responsibility. Communities, parents, regions, provinces as well as hon. members in the House have a responsibility to contribute in a positive way.

[Young Offenders Act, June 16th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, I am not sure that I would ever be capable of convincing the hon. member to believe anything the federal government does. I am sure he will recognize that since we have been in government there has been a boost in the economy. We have created 183,000 jobs since we were elected. Sixty-six thousand of those jobs have gone to Quebec. We have just had the signing of the infrastructure program recently.

Our youth initiative is an initial first step. We believe that this is one way to stimulate a very downtrodden and a very cynical group of young people who have been marginalized. We do not feel in the five and half months we have been in office we have had enough time to do all of the things we should do.

The hon. member spoke about consultation. This from the party that did not agree with us interfering jurisdictionally by bringing forward this program. We had nothing but headaches and heartaches from its members. Now they want into the program. I am glad. Any time the hon. member wants to put forward a proposal I would be more than happy to receive it. I would be happy to meet with him outside the Chamber to discuss this program. I would also be happy to discuss all of the other programs we have.

The opposition members know we are having a very difficult time. We are streamlining, restructuring and in some cases collapsing boards and getting rid of programs that duplicate other services. This will allow us to reallocate for other positive purposes such as the youth service corps. We managed to maintain a level of service that is adequate for the public.

I do not really know what the hon. member is complaining about. However, I am certainly willing to work with him in the future on all of these initiatives.

[Young Offenders Act, June 16th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, this is directly from the news release of the Minister of Justice who tabled the amendments on the Young Offenders Act.

The highlights of the bill include: increased sentences for teenagers convicted of first or second degree murder in youth court to ten and seven years respectively; dealing with 16 and 17-year olds charged with serious personal injury offences in adult court, unless they can show a judge that public protection and rehabilitation can both be achieved through youth court; and extending the time that 16 and 17-year old young offenders who have been convicted of murder in an adult court must serve before they can be considered for parole.

The bill also includes: improved measures for information sharing between professionals, like school officials and police with selected members of the public when public safety is at risk; retaining the record of serious young offenders; provisions that will encourage rehabilitation and treatment of young offenders in the community when this is appropriate.

This does not necessarily speak to the question the member asked. I do believe in the various communities that will be affected by this legislation there are people, for example the provincial and territorial justice ministers, who are looking at attempts to better deal with young offenders in their own regions and provinces. That might include community service work for example.

One suggestion has proved to be quite viable in the aboriginal community. Young offenders have been sent out on the land to do hard physical labour in camps. They have had to cut wood, haul water and do a lot of physical work. It has been found that the recidivism rate with those young offenders is virtually nil. It is not necessarily boot camp. They learn something. They learn how to survive. They learn coping skills. They regain their self-esteem. Those are the kinds of ideas that are being entertained and I do not find them totally offensive if they are coupled with other positive rehabilitative measures.

[Young Offenders Act, June 16th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, I am pleased to rise and speak today in support of the government's recent actions to crack down on violent young offenders who commit serious crimes.

As a preamble to my speech, we all have responsibilities in this country that we should not predicate the effectiveness of programs on what our political agendas are. I think we have a responsibility for the young people of this country and this piece of legislation and the amendments are clearly to address the needs that are there.

I am happy to be a member of Parliament and a contributing member so to speak who will perhaps add to a healthy debate and make viable suggestions that would fortify the country, bring people together and carve out a future for young people in this country rather than talk about some rather destructive means that would not bring any enjoyment or any good health to the country such as it is.

I am pleased that on June 2 the Minister of Justice tabled amendments to the Young Offenders Act. These amendments recognize the public's growing concern about youth violence and demonstrate the priority this government places on protecting the public.

These amendments, by shifting the onus on young people to take responsibility for their violent crimes, sends a strong signal to young people that their actions carry serious consequences. We are a country that basically wants Canadians to know that we all have a responsibility for our country and consequently for our actions.

However, as the Minister of Justice made clear, legislation is only one part of the answer to violence among young people. Protecting the public is the primary and necessary objective but we must focus our attention on helping our young people if we are to find lasting and effective solutions to youth crime.

I am encouraged to see that the amendments to the Young Offenders Act include provisions for the rehabilitation and treatment of young offenders in the community. There are many complex questions surrounding youth crime, questions that the Standing Committee on Justice and Legal Affairs will be examining as part of the reform of the youth justice system.

I welcome the opportunity to work with my colleagues in the House to take action on the contributing factors to crime and violence such as unemployment, poverty, alcoholism, drug and substance abuse, family violence, racism and illiteracy.

This is not to say that any of those factors justifies any kind of violent crimes or should contribute to saying that young people have the right to commit crimes. These are mitigating factors. These are things that make it very difficult for young people to have a life that is well, a life that is healthy and a life that keeps them from the negative side of life, so to speak.

Socioeconomic misery and crime are two sides of the same coin. By addressing these problems in our society we will be tackling the root causes of youth crime and ultimately adult crime. It does not take any stretch of the imagination to see how such socioeconomic misery fuels anger, frustration, anti-social behaviour and criminal activity among young people.

I would like the House to consider the adverse conditions that many of our aboriginal youth face as they walk through the perilous path to adulthood. Unemployment among aboriginal people is twice the Canadian level. It is the number one problem facing aboriginal communities and they have the lowest incomes of anyone in the country.

The illiteracy rate among aboriginal people is twice the national average. High school dropout rates can be as high as95 per cent in isolated northern communities; 57.7 per cent of aboriginal people are under the age of 24. The aboriginal population is very young, growing fast and on the move.

The majority of aboriginal peoples do not live on reserves and the migration of on-reserve aboriginal peoples to urban centres particularly in western Canada is increasing. In Manitoba it is estimated that one out of four new entrants into the job market will be of aboriginal origin. In Saskatchewan it will be one out of three.

Are they destined for a life of unemployment, social problems, crime? The odds seem stacked against them but this need not be the case. Five to six times the number of aboriginal peoples are incarcerated in provincial and federal institutions as compared with aboriginal peoples in the general population. Yet aboriginal peoples only represent approximately 3.7 per cent of the Canadian population.

The state of many aboriginal peoples in Canada is not a pretty picture. Despite these socioeconomic problems, progress has been made in health, education, economic community development and social services.

Such progress is often linked to aboriginal peoples having culturally appropriate services controlled by aboriginal peoples. I am proud to be a part of a government that recognizes the enormous potential that our young people have to offer and that is prepared to invest in their abilities and to give them hope and opportunities for the future.

This government has implemented a number of programs and services we feel will help aboriginal youth and other youth as well recognize their strengths and grow to their full potential and to see the sun on the horizon in an optimistic manner.

I, as Secretary of State for Training and Youth, and the Minister of Human Resources Development have announced a youth strategy. This strategy will attack some of the root causes for turning youth into young offenders.

In my riding last month we made a contribution to a youth program with the Gwich'in people. The Gwich'in people have taken it upon themselves to build their own healing centre, to deal with many of their social and justice issues, many of their health issues. They have done so along with the partnership they are building with people who have the expertise in and outside their own communities.

Last month we announced 37 projects as part of the first wave of Youth Service Canada. We believe it is necessary to send a signal that young people can contribute to rather than take away from their communities. Many think of young people very negatively because young offenders tend to get all the stories, all the ink. The news media always covers them. However many young people are doing wonderful things but are not being celebrated or recognized.

Youth Service Canada aims to help 18 to 24-year olds gain work experience, develop their skills, learn good work habits and improve their self-esteem through community service projects. Youth Service Canada should provide opportunities for youth to break away from the socioeconomic factors which have held them back and have seduced some to become involved in a life of crime.

Recently I attended the University of Calgary's graduation for its native students. It has graduated 18 native students with university degrees, some of them with a Bachelor of Social Work, some of them with a Bachelor of Education. A young woman graduated with an engineering degree. Those young people are very healthy models of outstanding citizens who will help their communities and this country.

So far it is not all bad news. These 18 students from the University of Calgary graduated under the leadership ofMr. George Callion who works with native students across Canada. He works on the Calgary Police Commission and contributes in a number of ways.

It takes leadership. It takes caring. It takes generosity. These must be expressed to our young people to encourage them and to let them know that the government cares and the people in their communities care. We must let them know that we in this House care about them and are directing our efforts to deal with those things.

Thus far from all the colleges and universities across Canada, there have been 92,000 aboriginal graduates. That is quite a huge cadre of professionals who will contribute in some way to their communities.

On Monday the Edmonton Journal featured the graduation of native law students. Five or six of them were pictured on the front. I know most of them, but the one that leaped out at me was none other than Mr. Brad Enge from the Northwest Territories. He is a native student and a 20-year veteran of the RCMP who has contributed to his community and his country. He is a proud Canadian who has worked hard for law and order. He is a proud Canadian who has worked for the young people in his community. He is a model for these young people.

That is how it is done. Success is the way in the native communities to bring further successes. These 92,000 graduates thus far, along with the law students who were pictured on the front page of the Edmonton Journal are the way to go.

There is more than one way to deal with young offenders, the whole issue of social justice and a number of other justice issues as well. There is rehabilitation but there is also the way of leadership, young people who set an example as those people will do.

Part of the consultations on the concept of Youth Service Canada had me in contact with many youth across Canada. I met with hundreds of groups. We talked about all the bad things which are happening.

I had the occasion to go to the SkyDome stadium in Toronto. There were 50,000 young people accompanied by their teachers. They were celebrating what they called the journey of hope. It was a positive celebration to show that Canada's young people are not just involved in crimes. They are doing many wonderful things.

I have attended many graduations across the country, many of which involved aboriginal youth, but many of which involved ordinary Canadian citizens.

It is positive and wonderful to see people doing something constructive for which they get no credit. I wanted to celebrate that with my hon. colleagues.

Speaking about the Youth Service Canada I believe that every department and crown corporation will do its part to forge those partnerships which will produce healthier and better contributing young people across Canada.

In the Dene language we have what is called Dene Tulu. It is the path you walk on and the path you walk on is the path of your own choosing. We have integrated that as one stream into the youth services corps because of the young people who have been marginalized or have been left out, who have dropped out of school and have given up learning and are out of the labour market. Essentially, they become so marginalized they drop out of life. We need to rebuild their confidence. We have to get them back to work and back to learning.

This stream called the Dene Tulu or Tulu would have them contributing. Whether the path you choose is good or bad is really up to you. That is the Dene form of justice. Tulu is one of our four guiding themes for Youth Service Canada to look at directly assisting those young offenders who are in community based rehabilitation programs.

Young offenders were also prominent at some of our consultations across Canada, along with the disabled and the homeless youth. Youth Service Canada is one part of the government's actions to help young people to make the transition from school to the workforce or to reintegrate into society.

We could talk about the many attempts which the government has put forward. We have put forward a youth strategy and a youth internship program. We have been discussing the changes to the Canada student loans program. They will help young people to participate positively in their learning for future jobs they will engage in for nation building. There are exercises in their communities at the community and regional levels.

For that reason part of the youth internship approach is industry driven and involves the sectors of automotive repair, logistics, environment, electrical manufacturing, horticulture and tourism. Aboriginal youth will benefit from the youth internship, acquiring the hands-on knowledge and skills required in today's workforce.

The success of all our young people as they step into the adult world is crucial not only for their own self-esteem but also for the well-being and prosperity of society as a whole. The government stay in school aboriginal campaign is using innovative methods to increase public awareness and spur community action to reverse the appalling trend of having young people drop out of school, to the tune of 95 per cent in some areas as I have indicated.

A lot of discussion that preceded these amendments to the Young Offenders Act focused on violent crime and a need to get tough with young criminals. However let us not lose sight of the fact that less than 20 per cent of the youth crimes are violent acts. Of course they get most of the attention. It is very unfortunate and very negative that that is what usually gets a lot of the ink and the air time.

Let us not lose sight of the fact that less than 20 per cent are violent acts. Most youth crimes are property and alcohol related. Getting tough and throwing these young people behind bars is not necessarily the best answer in these situations. We are not saying that leniency is the answer. We are saying that perhaps there are other ways of forging relationships and partnerships that will help to reconstruct and rebuild communities.

We as parents have a responsibility. When a child is born and when a young child leaves the house to go to kindergarten, you do not know how that child will turn out. But if you do not do your level best, if you do not do everything in your power as a responsible member of the community to provide the nurturing, love and guidance for that child, it is almost guaranteed that you are sealing the fate of that child to a life of negativity and downfall. Even if you do everything right there is no guarantee but if you do not do anything to help young people you are almost sealing their fate to a life that is not very positive.

I encourage all the people who affect young people in the communities. It takes one person to make a positive impact on your life. That person could be a counsellor, an RCMP officer, a teacher. That person could be a friend, an aunt, or an uncle. Somebody to be there to reach out and encourage a young person is what it takes sometimes.

Remember, the responsibility is not just in legislation or amendments. The responsibility is the relationship we forge as members of this wonderful country, members of our wonderful and diverse communities, that contribute to making life better for everyone.

We have a responsibility for Canada's future which is going to be drawn out through the young people whom we nurture, guide and teach. Government and all of the governance we leave behind is in their hands. We have an onerous responsibility, but if we do nothing, we will reap nothing.

I appeal to all Canadians to remember that laws are guides. They guide us. We work in the highest court in the land. We are building, remaking and changing laws, but we cannot legislate caring, loving and nurturing, the things that we have to give to ensure that the situation with young offenders is abated.

[Youth, June 10th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member's riding is one of six lead sites which are being implemented in Ontario. The Institute for Enterprise Education will provide 15 young Canadians with the opportunity to develop business and entrepreneurial skills. All lead sites will be up and running by the end of July.

I am also pleased to announce that another set of 20 to 30 lead sites will be announced at the beginning of next month.