House of Commons photo

Crucial Fact

  • His favourite word was bay.

Last in Parliament September 2008, as Liberal MP for Thunder Bay—Rainy River (Ontario)

Lost his last election, in 2011, with 22% of the vote.

Statements in the House

Citizen Engagement May 3rd, 2005

Mr. Chair, the member for Scarborough--Rouge River, who has written a history of many of these changes that have gone through the parliamentary process, is the author of this riveting book on the changes that have occurred. If the member has seen it in action, then we must know that it can be done. I really think it can only enhance each and every party member and each and every representative here in terms of the way our constituents view us and other nations view us.

I cannot believe it could get any worse. As a first term MP I share some of the disillusionment of coming into a place where I really expected that I would be able to hear someone speaking without having to plug into a machine.

I like the idea from soccer but in here it might be more of a checkered flag. However just that suggestion tells me that many of us are thinking the same thing, and that is that it has to be better than this. I truly think that if we were to put our minds to it, it could work. I cannot see any Canadian citizen disagreeing with us.

Citizen Engagement May 3rd, 2005

Mr. Chair, I have talked to several of the member's colleagues from the 1993 class of several parties. I am aware of that exercise in an attempt to set a new standard to try and bring decorum and civility to the House. Members can see I am already crossing boundaries here in terms of understanding the historical nature of that.

The interesting thing in this “not for your daily reading journal” is there are several instances in which the Speaker of the day, when they asked for decorum and order, ruled in favour of the hecklers, saying that heckling was part of the bit here. From what I have seen in my short time, I believe the bit is now controlling the entire show. For us to have an intelligent discussion on this, and I wish everyone was as intelligent as the member sitting in the House tonight, we have to believe we have to start somewhere.

I am absolutely unmitigatedly convinced that the Canadian public wants us to behave differently in this House. No matter how good the show is between 2 p.m. and 3 p.m., I know they would rather something different.

Some of the councils I have served on have also been known as boring types of council, but they rolled up their sleeves and they got the job done. In a democracy, people would much rather see their elected representatives with their sleeves rolled up, producing good work, than someone rehearsing their lines and then coming in and acting indignant.

I would be willing to work with any member of any party who shares those ideas. I know several of the member's colleagues opposite have expressed that idea to me already.

Citizen Engagement May 3rd, 2005

Madam Chair, I was really looking forward to this debate. I am so pleased that it has come forward as a take note debate because one of the major reasons that I ran was to involve more people in the democratic process, and citizens' engagement is truly a worthy endeavour for all parties in this House.

I believe that as parliamentarians we have the ultimate role to play in bringing people back into the parliamentary and democratic process. The best way we can do that is to set the highest possible standards for ourselves as members of Parliament. This implies respect, honesty, integrity, trust, accessibility and accountability. I will focus my time on the impressions that we convey to Canadians, especially young people and visitors to this House.

Reforms must start right here in the heart of it all. I find as a first term MP that the lack of decorum, civility and just good manners is generally very appalling. When I see the high school groups come here, and these are award-winning students in many cases representing a forum of young Canadians, Rotaries, youth scholars, Student Connections, and they watch the debates, they just leave shaking their heads. I watch them and they are very disappointed. If any one of them had ever behaved such as we might in this House, they would be booted right out of class and suspended.

That in itself should give each and every one of us in the House pause for concern because several hundred young people a week come to see the speeches here in the House, at question period in particular. For those of us who come from a municipal background, and I have spoken to members from all parties, they are generally astounded at the lack of civility and the type of antics that go on here, especially disruptions. When we talk about respect, this would never happen in any municipal forum anywhere in the country. That it goes on is really quite shocking, particularly to people who have already served in some sort of democratic process.

When we think about people who are involved, who are engaged, people who are close to local government, who appear as deputations and delegations, they see firsthand the mayor, the head of council, the reeve rule anyone with the least provocation starting to speak out of order or out of turn and immediately order is restored. Why we cannot do that here in this very impressive chamber is something that I have not yet come to understand.

Indeed, immunity applies somewhat in municipal spheres, but here it seems to have been stretched to its ultimate limits of abuse. The ultimate test should be that if someone truly had something to say that was honest and truthful, they would be able to say it outside in the hall. The fact that they never dare to do that, even when challenged, should give each and every one of us pause to think of what is really happening in this House.

Are people taking advantage of a process that protects them and impugns others? Once it is out, once the media in the gallery hears the statement, once it goes into Hansard , then it is there and it can be used, no, it can be abused far more greatly than anyone would ever want their own name to be impugned.

As I have been watching this for the past number of months, it occurred to me that perhaps something in the order of a private member's motion would be appropriate because when we talk about the engagement of citizens, they are not going to come back if they do not respect what we are doing. They are not going to participate in something that they cannot relate to, and if they are appalled and disgusted, then they are not going to project that to the young people or to other voters.

What I am proposing in my private member's bill is to restore civility and decorum to the House, particularly under Standing Orders 16 and 18. Standing Order 16 is that there will be no interruptions while someone is giving an answer or asking a question. Standing Order 18 is that people will act respectfully toward each other.

It will take all parties to agree to this. I know some people are smiling and saying “mission impossible”, but we have to agree that if it can be done in other orders of government, it certainly should be here in this Parliament.

As a student of this exercise, I undertook some light reading, House of Commons Procedure and Practice . I came across many interesting things. I have read it cover to cover. I am not going to say I just read it during opposition speeches. I read it while I was in the House doing my House duty. We know attempts have been made in the past by other parties to try to restore decorum and civility. In at least one case, historically, it came to third reading and someone was almost getting there.

As I enjoy my first term, I have met people from all parties who I feel share these values, who are cordial and respectful. Therefore, there is no one monopoly and there is no one guilty party in this exercise.

I guess we can use the adage of the mother asking the two children when did they start fighting and one says, “It started when he hit me back”. We know this is the kind of thing where there is no sense trying to say “You guys are the bad guys” or “You are the bad people”. We might as well just ask if there is a way that we can do this better for the people of our country. I believe very strongly that we have to do it.

We also get visitors from other countries. Some may think our rules or our procedures may be lax. I do not know. I have not seen many other houses. I am only concerned about this one.

I believe that if we are absolutely serious about citizen engagement, citizens will become engaged when they see us behave with respect, decorum, civility and when a question is asked, the person is allowed to ask it without being heckled and someone is allowed to answer without being chastised or commented upon.

This book of course has several interesting things. It does prohibit singing, except for the national anthem. When one reads some of the anecdotal history of some of the infractions, it is possible that perhaps there is a requirement for more enforcement by the Speaker, I do not know.

However, I know that among ourselves, as good parliamentarians who care about the country first and foremost, we are only here by the good graces of the people who elected us. The least we can do for them is to show them how much they mean to us. For me, it means that I can go back and say to them, “I asked your question. I got your answer”, and they can say to me, “I actually could hear you ask the question and get the answer”.

If we want to be closer to the people, it must start here. I look forward to presenting that. I thank the hon. members for allowing me to speak tonight. I am glad I stayed to hear the arguments put forth on all sides.

Committees of the House April 21st, 2005

Mr. Speaker, as members of the committee, they know that certainly it is within the committee's power to call those people and ask for a status report to see what the pace of that is. I would recommend that to them and to just keep moving rather than reinventing the wheel and starting from scratch again; I say to go faster. That to me would be true progress and progressive thinking.

Committees of the House April 21st, 2005

Mr. Speaker, respectfully, when we have three sets of answers, we have to question what kind of productive result there would be from going back and doing it one more time.

If the committee really wants to move rapidly, I believe that in this type of situation we can actually do much more by going to the action items. We would have the desired results even faster. That would be my response. We have it three times and to get it a fourth time would perhaps reinforce what has been done already, but to me that would be a diversion and a dilution of the energy available.

Committees of the House April 21st, 2005

Mr. Speaker, I would respectfully acknowledge that six of the seven items are action items, and one is to go back to study again something that has been thoroughly studied, which can only delay what I would see as action and responsiveness.

Committees of the House April 21st, 2005

Mr. Speaker, in response let me say that my riding now extends from Lake Superior to the Manitoba border. Over the period of time since the last election, the farming and agricultural communities have taken a great deal of time to educate me in terms of these issues. Poultry does not happen to be a large component of the agricultural industry, but certainly the nature of the experiences people have shared with me tell me that once there has been an examination of a subject three times by very expert people, internationally, locally and nationally, that would tell us that we do have some answers. The farmers of my riding would say that once we have enough answers, it is time for action.

I believe that what I have seen here and in discussing this report tells me that it would be much better for the agricultural community to accelerate an action plan rather than go back and re-gaze, rehash and study again something that has been very thoroughly reviewed. Offering the wisdom of the House to a committee's report with this amendment is what I am representing here.

There is an expression from a movie by a group that I am sure all members of the House would characterize as a group of international renown, the Monty Python group. When a person presented a shrubbery to one of the characters, the character said each time, “You shall bring me...another shrubbery!” In this case we already have three studies and three sets of recommendations, so we really do not need another shrubbery.

Committees of the House April 21st, 2005

Madam Speaker, the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food has presented a thorough and, on the whole, balanced appraisal of the need to learn the lessons of the avian influenza outbreak.

As the report acknowledges, the Canadian Food Inspection Agency recognizes that there is room to improve. It goes on to say that all stakeholders could have been better prepared. The report states, “No matter how careful the preparation there are always uncontrollable events”.

That is the nature of emergency planning. We can and we must prepare for emergencies. Many steps can be taken to improve an emergency management system but with every emergency comes new developments not foreseen in the contingency plans.

Perhaps the true test of an excellent emergency response system is: first, how well it follows the recognized procedures for controlling the situation; second, how effectively it responds for the unexpected; and third, how effectively it incorporates the lessons learned so that we may be better prepared the next time.

On each of these tests I believe Canada has demonstrated that we have an excellent system. Canada's system of following the acknowledged procedures was attested to by an international panel of experts. Following the eradication of the outbreak, the government asked the panel to give its opinion of the response. The panel found that the disease control actions were consistent with internationally accepted principles. It found that the surveillance system and the surveillance protocols were appropriate. It found that the movement restrictions, procedures for destruction of infected birds and disposal of infected birds and products were all appropriate. It found that pre-emptive depopulation, the process for considering exemptions and the cleaning and disinfection procedures were appropriate.

An independent panel of international experts said that the CFIA did the right things. In fact, the panellists complimented the CFIA on its response. One panellist highlighted such features as the very good level of cooperation between the CFIA, its provincial counterparts and other provincial and municipal authorities.

Another expert wrote:

The logistics of this whole operation was huge, and improvisation of machinery available to deal with this problem was a credit to those concerned.

Another panellist wrote:

Canada was adequately prepared to deal with the outbreak of highly pathogenic avian influenza and had in place the appropriate regulations, veterinary infrastructure, and resources to facilitate the successful eradication of the disease.

Therefore, on the first test of an effective emergency system, Canada has received the acclaim of our international colleagues.

However we recognize that some of our linkages with our partners in the provinces and the industry could have been stronger and we are working on that through the recommendations of the lessons learned report.

What about the second test, the ability to respond to unforeseen circumstances? When the mission from the European commission made its final report it praised the innovative measures and the improvements to the procedures that emerged in light of new developments.

Let me give the House one example where decisive action on the part of the Canadian Food Inspection Agency moved beyond the standard procedures and made a significant impact.

When the first case of avian influenza was detected there were two possible strains: one, a low pathogenic variety; the other, highly pathogenic, or HP. The response to HP avian influenza calls for a much more dramatic response in restricting movement within a control zone. The tests to determine whether the disease is high or low pathogenicity require about a week for the results. In that amount of time a highly pathogenic strain could spread far.

Even though the standard procedures recommended that decisions be based on scientific evidence and even though there were many voices that recommended against imposing control restriction for HP avian influenza, the CFIA acted decisively. It determined that it would not risk the possibility that this strain was highly pathogenic.

I would recommend to the House that this was not a popular decision at the time, but as it turned out, it was the right decision and the CFIA is to be highly commended for making a decision that, in the end, was instrumental in controlling and eradicating the disease so quickly.

Canada did well in the first two tests in effective emergency response system. It followed the accepted procedures, but where new developments arose, it responded quickly and decisively.

The third test is whether we learn how to improve the system so that we are better prepared the next time. Here again, the committee's report acknowledges that considerable effort is being made to draw upon our experiences to apply the lessons.

In addition to the standing committee's own hearings, there was a Canadian poultry industry forum in Abbotsford last October. The CFIA has conducted a process entitled “Lessons Learned Review” that forms the basis of building a better emergency response system.

There are places where the recommendations from the report before us augment the action plan developed by the CFIA but, unfortunately, there is one recommendation that would sidetrack some of the excellent work that is already under way. I do not believe that we need another commission to study the events of last year, not when the committee itself has been so thorough, open and transparent in obtaining the input from witnesses.

As a former mayor and a former president of three provincial municipal organizations over a 22 year period, I am very aware of the processes of emergency planning, emergency response and emergency reporting and analysis. The reports that we have seen seek to improve a system that was tested by the crisis a year ago when the flu broke out in the lower Fraser Valley. The outbreak was devastating for the people in the region but in assessing the lessons it is very important to keep in mind that the tragedy could have been much worse.

The disease spreads like wildfire through poultry farms. In Canada there was the potential for a vast outbreak. In fact, the control area had some 600 poultry farms all within a fairly dense region but only 42 commercial farms were implicated and the disease remained confined to the lower Fraser Valley. Our trading partners continued to accept products from other regions of Canada.

Clearly, Canada was doing many things right during this influenza outbreak. This is a tribute to the partnerships among all stakeholders, including federal departments and agencies, provincial and municipal governments, the private sector, the veterinary community and, not least, the people of the lower Fraser Valley.

However not everything went right. There are lessons to be learned so we can be better prepared should Canada face another crisis of this magnitude. Clearly, the CFIA, for its part, has been working hard to improve its emergency response system.

In a document entitled “Lessons Learned Review”, the CFIA outlined 17 major recommendations and some 50 individual action items to improve our emergency response system. Many of these action items improve our emergency response system and some cover familiar ground to the recommendations of the committee's report. The House should keep this in mind when determining how to respond.

The report's first recommendation, for example, calls for a public inquiry into the events of last year. I have not heard a convincing explanation as to what such an inquiry would find that we do not know already. Would such an inquiry call upon the same witnesses who appeared before the committee? Would they have anything different to say?

In my view, the most troubling implication of recommendation one is that it would require the CFIA to redirect resources to respond to the commission's business. These are resources that are better used in moving ahead on the action plan already in place.

The second recommendation calls for the Auditor General to examine the response to last year's crisis in order to provide benchmark information for emergency response effectiveness. The government would welcome this review. However a review would be most useful in 18 to 24 months, at which point action plan items from the lessons learned will have been implemented.

The third recommendation calls for a special animal disease response team. The CFIA has already put in place a similar system through area emergency response teams. As part of the action plan, the CFIA has committed to revising the structure of its emergency response team so that the roles, responsibilities and delegated decision making are more clearly defined. It is reviewing the protocols on when to activate local area and national emergency response teams. The agency is working with stakeholders to develop plans for foreign animal disease emergency support agreements.

Recommendation four would have the government do a cost benefit analysis to study the need for additional containment level three facilities. The government has agreed to proceed with this recommendation. I would like to point out to the House that the CFIA is also taking important steps to accredit laboratory facilities outside the federal laboratory system across the country so that it can use them to assist with surveillance and provide surge capacity in such emergencies. Four labs have already been approved, including the provincial lab in Abbotsford.

Recommendation five involves the methods to euthanize animals. The government has agreed to this recommendation and I would add that during the outbreak the CFIA considered various options to euthanize the birds but the alternatives were ruled out because of the operational requirements. The use of carbon dioxide to depopulate the flocks was consistent with recommendations of the American Veterinary Medical Association panel on euthanasia and l'Office international de l'épizootie, the international organization of animal health. The method was found to be an effective technique and the CFIA refined the process to maximize its effectiveness, particularly with respect to animal health and human health and safety issues. It has been recognized that carbon dioxide does present some challenges with waterfowl but no alternative has been suggested at this time.

Recommendation six involves compensation issues. Approximately $63.5 million has been paid out to British Columbia producers under the health of animals regulations. In addition, the Canadian agricultural income stabilization program may provide support to producers by covering some of their losses.

However the compensation question remains an open issue. All stakeholders, including the industry, must assume some of the risk and various marketplace insurance schemes provide part of the solution. The government agrees with the recommendation to review the existing compensation under the Health of Animals Act.

Finally, recommendation seven involves procedures to permit a pre-emptive cull to limit the potential spread of an outbreak of animal diseases. The government has accepted this recommendation. In fact, in partnership with the industry, the CFIA has already been putting in place a pre-emptive cull policy. An interim protocol is already in effect and a permanent protocol should be in place before the end of the year.

The committee has worked very hard to obtain a broad and detailed perspective of what took place during the avian influenza outbreak last year. In some respects, the thoroughness of the committee's efforts preclude the need for its first recommendation, establishing another commission to study the situation further.

While the committee was working so diligently to hear from the various stakeholders affected by the outbreak, other stakeholders were moving quickly to adapt the lessons learned. Some of the committee's measures that have been put in place in recent months echo the themes of its report.

There are some recommendations here that build upon what is now being done. Unfortunately, however, the report taken as a whole would distract stakeholders such as the CFIA from the important work they are now doing, so at this point I move:

That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after “that” and substituting the following therefore:

“that the Third Report of the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food, presented to the House, be not now concurred in but that it be referred back to the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food for further consideration”.

Thunder Bay Law Association April 20th, 2005

Mr. Speaker, today I rise in the House to extend congratulations to the Thunder Bay Law Association on the occasion of its 100th anniversary.

As the association marks law day, it is worthy to note its efforts to serve not only its members but the broader community by providing continuing legal education, maintaining a reference law library, providing a forum for communication, discussion and advocacy of paralegal issues, as well as promoting other activities of a non-profit nature.

If the legal profession in general is known for its sense of collegiality, congeniality and camaraderie, then this sentiment may be an accurate description of the Thunder Bay Law Association. May it continue to grow and prosper over the next 100 years.

Immigration April 19th, 2005

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration outline some serious initiatives the government has taken to improve our system of immigration?