Jean Crowder

[Supply, November 15th, 2005]

Mr. Speaker, I want to deal specifically with two issues in this important motion by the member for Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre.

One is clause (a) about expanding coverage of the act to all crown corporations, all officers of Parliament and all foundations. It is the foundations I want to focus on. Then there is clause (c) about establishing a duty on public officials to create the records necessary to document their actions and decisions.

The member for Yellowhead raised some of the issues that I think are germane to this conversation. Earlier, the justice minister talked about a meaningful democratic process and how critical it is to have access to information. When we are talking about democratic process and access to information, a variety of issues enter into this conversation. One of them is transparency. One of them is openness.

One is around the fundamental issue about demonstrating that the Canadian people can have confidence in the fact that their government is a well run government, in the fact that when taxpayers' dollars are being spent they are being spent in a way that is accountable and responsible and is producing the results that are important for Canadians.

The Minister of Justice also referred to the fact that the member for Winnipeg Centre had a private member's bill before the House. There was a discussion around whether the member would put that bill forward. It is the member's understanding and mine as well that the member for Winnipeg Centre had some assurance that if he dropped his private member's bill there would be a bill before the House to deal with this very important matter.

As we talk about access and transparency, I am going to talk about a couple of incidents, although I know my time is short. One is that the health committee currently is dealing with the issue of silicone gel breast implants.

A part of the access to information issues that this motion deals with is the issue of the records that officials keep. There were scientific panel hearings in March. The health committee asked for the minutes from those hearings only to discover that no minutes were kept.

For parliamentarians who want to find out what was conducted in those scientific hearings, which are going to be used to inform the minister's decision, there are no minutes. That is a huge problem. We have information that is germane to a decision and is important for parliamentarians to be aware of and we cannot access it.

It would seem to me that in most organizations when important decisions are being made and important recommendations are being made by key decision makers, there should be a record kept of how those recommendations were arrived at.

That is one example of the lack of information for parliamentarians. There is another example, although it falls loosely outside of the intent of this motion. The committee has also been attempting to get a 1996 cohort study that is being bounced from Health Canada to the Public Health Agency. We really cannot find this study. We cannot get access to this very critical piece of information. Access to information is fundamental to transparency and openness.

The member for Yellowhead talked about the Auditor General . I am going to talk specifically about the 2002 and 2005 reports of the Auditor General. I think it is important that in 2002 the Auditor General said about her findings that:

The essential requirements for accountability to Parliament--credible reporting of results, effective ministerial oversight, and adequate external audit--are not being met....

This is with regard to foundations and such.

The Auditor General also indicated in 2002 that:

Parliament is not receiving reports on independent, broad-scope audits that examine more than the financial statements of delegated arrangements, including compliance with authorities, propriety, and value for money. With a few exceptions, Parliament's auditor should be appointed as the external auditor of existing foundations and any created in the future, to provide assurance that they are exercising sound control of the significant public resources and authorities entrusted to them.

That seems to be a grave gap. We have billions of dollars going to foundations and yet Parliament has no oversight of this.

The Auditor General suggested a couple of key questions which I think are fundamental. It would be perfectly reasonable that parliamentarians and the public would have access to these key questions. The Auditor General suggested four key questions: Is there reasonable assurance that stewardship of public money is sound? Are the terms and conditions of the funding agreements generally respected? Is the arrangement achieving the intended public results? Are the programs and activities of the delegated arrangement consistent and coordinated adequately with related federal programs and activities?

When we are talking about foundations, it would seem that parliamentarians should have access to the kind of information that is laid out in these questions. These are fundamental. How are Canadian taxpayers' dollars being spent? Are they being spent responsibly? Are we getting the results that Canadian taxpayers expect from this kind of spending?

In 2002 we did not see a substantially different kind of circumstance, so here we are three years later hoping to see some sort of change in what is happening with foundations. The main points under the 2005 report again re-emphasize the issue. It states:

Despite a number of improvements to the framework for the accountability of foundations to Parliament, overall progress is unsatisfactory. Important gaps remain in the external audit regimen and ministerial oversight, two of the three areas examined in this audit. There is no provision for performance audits of foundations that are reported to Parliament nor do mechanisms from ministerial oversight adequately provide for the government to make adjustments to foundations where circumstances have changed considerably.

With all that has happened with the sponsorship scandal and the lack of transparency and openness, we are continuing to see the lack of action in having foundations audited by the Auditor General.

[Status of Women, November 15th, 2005]

Mr. Speaker, today in recognition of Persons Day 2005, six women were recognized for their outstanding contribution to the quality of life for women.

Bonnie Diamond is one of those recipients. A true champion for advancing gender equality, Bonnie has been a mentor and a leader in the Canadian women's movement for over 30 years. She has been at the forefront of many struggles including violence against women and equality for women.

She was an organizer of the World March of Women in 2000 and volunteers with many organizations including FAFIA, Media Watch and the Elizabeth Fry Society of Ottawa, all this while working as the executive director of the National Association of Women and the Law.

Bonnie is an important member of the Pay Equity Network, a group of more than 200 equality-seeking organizations and trade unions calling for proactive pay equity legislation.

Equal pay for work of equal value is a fundamental human right, yet more than 25 years after the adoption of the Canadian Human Rights Act, we have no federal legislation and women continue to earn less.

On behalf of the NDP caucus, I would like to say good work sister, the struggle continues.

[Question No. 205, November 4th, 2005]

With regard to funding by the government for the Sisters in Spirit campaign: ( a ) why has the funding been delayed; ( b ) when will the Native Women’s Association of Canada receive the funding; and ( c ) is the government still committed to delivering the funding in phases, as originally planned?

[First Nations Oil and Gas and Moneys Management Act, November 3rd, 2005]

Mr. Speaker, I have a question that relates directly to treaty negotiation and the issues around having resources available for first nations people.

In my riding, the Hul'qumi'num treaty group is an unusual position, where there is very little crown land. For example, oil and gas are not present in my riding, and I am sure there are other ridings throughout the country where there is not a large amount of crown land. As we are talking about resources and oil and gas and other resource management, would this bill deal with issues where perhaps there is virtually no public land for first nations to have access to?

[Bell Canada, November 2nd, 2005]

Mr. Speaker, since 1996, the Communication, Energy and Paperworkers Union has attempted to get Bell Canada to live up to its obligations to equal pay for work of equal value.

This case has been at the Human Rights Tribunal for almost 10 years and the hearing dates scheduled until 2009. Bell Canada has spent more than $35 million on a small army of lawyers to deny thousands of women working as telephone operators money they are entitled to by law.

Bell's consistent attack on women's human rights proves yet again the need for proactive federal pay equity legislation. The labour, justice and status of women ministers are all on record referring to pay equity as a fundamental human right, yet there is still no legislation to protect workers.

The NDP is calling on the Liberal government to stop forcing women to fight for decades for economic equality and introduce proactive pay equity legislation immediately.

The Standing Committee on the Status of Women has asked for legislation. Where is the legislation?

[Cross-Border Drug Sales, November 1st, 2005]

Madam Chair, the member for Charleswood--St. James--Assiniboia has given me a lot to comment on, so let me try to go through it because I am sure my time is running out.

On the human resource strategy, we have known for a number of years that we have been facing serious shortages in a number of health care occupations, yet the pan-Canadian strategy that has been asked for and continues to be asked for by a coalition of health care practitioners still is not there and we are now in a serious shortage. Many people in Canada cannot get family physicians. We have a serious problem.

To roll into that, we have physicians living in Canada who have foreign credentials and cannot get their foreign credentials recognized in Canada. There is a broad range of issues around a human resource strategy and I would encourage the Liberals to take action now on this because we will be talking about this in four more years' time if this keeps up.

On the issue of face to face consultation, it is very interesting that we say it is acceptable for some people in remote communities in Canada to rely on telehealth. We already do it. We already have people in Canada who have nurse practitioners, and as the member rightly pointed out, in the north. We already have these practices in place in Canada. If they are good enough for Canadians, surely we can look at the very professional practices that we already have in place to manage these kinds of situations and deal with them in the Internet pharmacy context.

I think the last thing is the unintended consequences. I think we have covered that in terms of talking about the fact that we already have practices in place where people do not see physicians face to face. The member rightly pointed out his own experience in terms of how we already have people who have to manage without that face to face consultation.

[Cross-Border Drug Sales, November 1st, 2005]

Madam Chair, I agree with the parliamentary secretary that the entrepreneurial aspect is a very important point, because we do encourage entrepreneurial activity in Canada. Again I will quote Health Canada's own website, which stated that by November 2004 it was estimated that of the over 7,000 pharmacies in Canada, approximately 270 operated either strictly via the Internet or through a combination. It is a very important piece of job creation in Canada and is more important in some provinces than others.

It would be irresponsible for us not to consider regulations and the protection of consumers. It is critical that those elements are included. My understanding is that there is a protocol already set up to address that, with two points to it. First, in the case of Internet pharmacies, the online purchases by consumers in the United States generally begin with a prescription from the doctor in the United States who has assessed them and the consumers then find a Canadian pharmacy and complete a form establishing their medical history. The online pharmacy then arranges for a doctor with a Canadian licence to review the prescription and co-sign it.

My understanding is that a number of Internet pharmacies were actually investigated and audited to make sure that people were in compliance with regulations that were set out. In general, it was found that most of the pharmacies were in compliance. Those that were not were written up and efforts were made to bring them into compliance.

In addition, the National Association of Boards of Pharmacy, which is a professional association that represents state boards of pharmacies in 50 states and a number of countries, also has been assisting members in developing, implementing and enforcing uniform standards. It has developed a certification for Internet pharmacies.

There is a substantial amount of work that is being done around making sure that the patient, the most vulnerable person, will not be at risk from this kind of practice, while at the same time ensuring that individuals have access to a safe supply of drugs.

When we are talking about numbers in Canada, I would absolutely agree with the hon. parliamentary secretary when he says that it is essential to have some sort of oversight to ensure that Canadians continue to have access to the drugs they depend upon. It is important to have some mechanism to protect Canadians, to oversee this and to ensure that Canadians come first when drugs are being supplied.

[Cross-Border Drug Sales, November 1st, 2005]

Madam Chair, I welcome the opportunity to take part in this very important debate.

We believe that access to a safe and reliable drug supply by Canadians is extremely important. However, we do not believe that Internet pharmacies with proper precautions threaten our drug supply. To be very clear, when I am talking about Internet pharmacies, I am not talking about bulk drug exports. I am talking about the individual relationship between consumers in the United States and Internet pharmacies.

Canadian Internet pharmacies currently supply between three million and six million Americans with chronic health problems who do not have medical insurance and are not eligible for medicaid. We are talking about a vulnerable population. Let us talk a bit more about these numbers.

People on medicaid cannot have their drugs covered if bought outside the U.S. and people on medical insurance do not need the hassle of buying drugs online. We are talking about a very small percentage of the market. It is about .5% of the U.S. pharmaceutical market.

These pharmacies cannot provide drugs needed on an acute basis such as antibiotics for an infection, nor can they provide the types of medication that require special storage like refrigeration.

Canadians are very concerned that this business will affect our own drug supply or affect the price regime that is currently set up in Canada, and these are valid concerns for Canadians.

Pharmaceutical companies must abide by the decisions of the Patented Medicine Prices Review Board, which governs the original sale price and any annual increase in new pharmaceuticals. If they were to give up that restriction, they would also give up the patent protection laws.

I want to refer specifically to some testimony that was given before the Standing Committee on Health by Donald Macarthur. He said that in Europe there is a legal and vital parallel trade in medicines. It is well regulated and provides significant direct and indirect savings to health care systems. There are incentives and sanctions to encourage pharmacists to participate in this parallel trade.

He talked a bit about the shortages that have occurred at times in Europe. He also talked about the fact that in 1998 Glaxo Wellcome, which is now GlaxoSmithKline, refused to supply wholesalers that did not sign up for its new general sales conditions. The government's competition authority had to step in with interim measures. This is an example of a manufactured shortage.

Macarthur went on to say that the reasons for drug shortages can be multiple and complex, including higher regulatory user fees, stricter good manufacturing principles, enforcement by regulatory authorities, plant rationalization as a consequence of company mergers, and just in time delivery practices leading to less availability of bigger stock in the distribution chain.

There are a number of factors that contribute to drug shortages when they occur. As I stated earlier, the government has assured us that it has oversight into drug shortages.

Most of the pressure to prevent cross-border sales in Canada has come from the big pharmaceutical companies that have lobbied hard for increased drug prices. They have also threatened to not introduce new breakthrough drugs or withdraw or slow research and development investment, and they have.

Although it is a requirement of Canada's generous drug patent laws that pharmaceutical companies maintain a base research and development percentage of 10%, that percentage has been declining and we are not holding those pharmaceutical companies to account for that decline.

Many of us in the House have heard of incredible drug price increases, for example, the price of the drug used to treat Hodgkin's Lymphoma called procarbazine. This is a drug that has been on the Canadian market for over 20 years. The manufacturer and distributor have recently increased the price from $48.40 for 100 capsules to $5,660 for 100 capsules. The distributor, Nucro-Technics, claims that the price increase from the manufacturer was justified because of U.S. cross-border shopping. This is smoke and mirrors. This cancer drug is used exclusively in hospitals. It is not provided through Internet pharmacies. Big Pharma is using cross-border sales as an excuse to increase the cost of drugs not currently covered by the PMPRB.

The NDP is not advocating closing Internet pharmacies to acquiesce to Big Pharma's demands. We need the Liberal government to start enforcing the patent laws.

They are some of the most generous patent laws in the world and big pharma cannot have it both ways. It cannot have all the protections from generic competition long past the time that other countries would have opened the market. It cannot refuse to abide by an agreement and reduce its commitment to research and development, and then complain when a small portion of Canadian drug sales go to a small segment of the U.S. population.

In an article by Michael Geist on February 7 of this year in the Toronto Star he said:

First, the refusal to supply drugs is already being challenged in both Canada and the U.S. with several pending antitrust lawsuits as well as complaints before the Canadian Competition Bureau. Second, the Canadian government could respond to the pharmaceutical companies by issuing compulsory licenses that would allow their generic pharmaceutical competitors to manufacture the same product in Canada provided the brand-name companies are given reasonable compensation. While such an approach would spark an outcry from the industry, no industry should be permitted to hold a country hostage with threats that undermine public health.

I think that comes to the crux of this matter.

However, the NDP does have one clear problem with Internet pharmacies. They do cause a shortage in the number of pharmacists who are available in Canada. This whole issue speaks to the lack of a pan-Canadian strategy to deal with human resources in the health care field. We have shortages of pharmacists, doctors, nurse practitioners, physiotherapists, and technicians for MRIs. There is a wide range of shortages in health care practitioners.

The practitioners themselves have been asking for years for a pan-Canadian strategy. They want the federal government to step up and take some leadership. It is a role that the federal government could play in terms of coordinating a pan-Canadian strategy. We need that kind of strategy to help us talk about the kinds of training needs that are going to emerge over the next 10 to 15 years, and the number of health care professionals that we are going to need in a variety of fields as we have an aging population.

When we are talking about Internet pharmacies and pharmacists, it is just one small part of the overall picture when we are talking about human resources.

When we are talking about this, we need to also make sure that students can actually afford to go to school. Students who go into a variety of health care professions come out with monumental debt loads. We need a very proactive program to ensure that access is there for students who wish to pursue a health care profession.

We agree that an important protection is the ban on bulk export drugs. It is absolutely essential that we have this ban on bulk export drugs. We are not interested in becoming a supplier to municipal governments or state governments for drugs. This is what one of the bulk exports could be used for.

An unscientific poll in the Globe and Mail and other news outlets clearly shows that a majority of Canadians thought cross-border sales should be allowed. That was an unscientific poll, but there was a measure out there that Canadians thought that Internet pharmacy sales were perfectly okay.

After seeing the signs of devastation in New Orleans after hurricane Katrina, I think even more Canadians will say that individual cross-border sales should be allowed. It would be nice to know that we were helping our American friends that truly need our help when they need it and not the owners of the big pharma companies.

As for the new rules that the Liberal government promoted back in July, we still have not seen any action. There is no legislation yet to ban cross-border sales. We have not seen the new drug supply network up and running yet.

This is not a new issue. This has been around for months. There was actually a meeting of deputy ministers of health around risk assessment of international pharmacies back in June 2004 and still we wait for action.

The NDP believes Internet pharmacies with proper controls, which are absolutely critical, do not threaten access to a safe, reliable supply of drugs by Canadians. There is action needed and we would like to see the Liberal government act on its pronouncements that it made earlier this year.

[Cross-Border Drug Sales, November 1st, 2005]

Madam Chair, in May 2004 Health Canada released three backgrounders with information on prescription drugs and Internet pharmacies regarding regulation, supply and cross-border sales.

On the supply side, and this is Health Canada's own information, it says that Health Canada actively investigates any drug shortage claims that are brought to its attention and where there is cause for concern, appropriate action is taken. The way I read this is that Health Canada is on it. It is paying close attention to any potential drug shortages.

The second piece is on cross-border sales. Health Canada says that neither Canada's international trade obligations nor our domestic laws prohibit these exports. Again, Health Canada's information is currently saying that Internet pharmacies and exports are okay.

In talking about price it says that the PMPRB regulates the first price at which the drug product is sold by the manufacturer, regardless of the purchaser, whether it be the wholesaler, pharmacy, hospital, or other.

The member has spoken about the difference between individual Internet sales versus bulk sales. They are completely separate.

It seems to me Health Canada's release is saying that individual sales are okay and that there are regulations to protect Canadians. I wonder if the member would comment on that specifically.

[Agriculture, November 1st, 2005]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak against the motion. I recognize that there are some very serious issues facing our farmers in terms of dealing with rodents that destroy crops and make it very difficult for farmers to maintain their livelihood. However I think it is very important that we talk about the context.

My colleague from the Bloc referred to the Pest Management Regulatory Agency. It would be great if we could have faith that this agency actually would protect the health and welfare of Canadians.

I point to a former pesticide that has recently been approved, 2,4-D. Its end use products were approved to treat lawns and turf. It was re-reviewed and it was determined that it did not entail an unacceptable risk of harm to human health or the environment. Perhaps Europeans are different from Canadians because 2,4-D is banned in Denmark, Norway and Kuwait and the registration is cancelled in Sweden and is severely restricted in Belize.

In 2002 a new Pest Control Products Act was proclaimed and yet the regulations were not promulgated for that act. Now if we did all of the work and the reviews and we developed regulations but never implemented them, one could question whether the process is rigorous enough for Canadians.

When we are talking about strychnine, one of the issues concerns the harm it does to other species. We know that rodents, squirrels and all manner of other creatures are eaten by other animals. There is also a chance for this kind of a product to actually get into water tables. We therefore must be very careful when we look at approving the use of such a high concentrate of a deadly substance.

I know this has come up in the House in the past and it has been a number of years since farmers have asked the government to take a look at their needs and to ensure the protection of their livelihood. I go back to a former member of the House, Dick Proctor from Palliser, who comes from a part of the country where this is very much a serious problem. I will quote from one of his former speeches in 2001. He stated:

I remind members, in the words of David Suzuki, that the human race is the most predatory animal in the history of the world. We have a phobia about eliminating anything and everything that gets in our way. Some day that is going to come back and cost us in a very large way.

This is a problem and I do not want to minimize it, but I think we need to and should look at alternatives. The issue has been around for 10 years. The government has absolutely failed to develop alternatives that would work as a replacement for liquid strychnine.

In that particular context, I think it is incumbent upon us to make a couple of points. Restrictions on the use of liquid strychnine were strengthened in 1993 due to its lethal effects on non-target animals that assist in controlling the gopher population, including raptors.

In our current context, just to say what is available for farmers, strychnine is currently available pre-mixed to farmers. As of April 17, 2005, there were 16 Canadian strychnine products registered. Ten were aimed at ground squirrels or gophers and were available in 0.4% concentrations. Two other products aimed at ground squirrels, one with 2% and one with 10% concentration, were available but both of them were listed as manufacturing concentrate.

All of the above uses of strychnine have been prohibited in the United States since 1988, so our neighbours to the south for a number of years have prohibited the use of this type of strychnine. It is illegal to use strychnine for pest control in most European countries and its use is prohibited by the Berne Convention on the Conservation of European Wildlife and Natural Habitats. When we hear citizens in many other countries of the world say that the use of strychnine is not acceptable in their countries, why would we consider it in Canada?

In Canada, farmers have to put the bait in the ground at least 18 inches. They have to bury the carcasses, so that the eagles, dogs and other animals would not be contaminated and spread the problem. We acknowledge that there is a danger of contaminating other animals that could have access to this.

Strychnine is highly toxic or very highly toxic to birds, frogs and mammals. In humans, the symptoms of strychnine poisoning begin 15 to 30 minutes after ingestion. It is important to talk about what happens to people when they ingest this product.

There may be an initial violent convulsion or minor stimulation may trigger violent convulsions. Breathing stops and the patient turns blue. The muscles relax completely between convulsions. There is cold sweat and the pupils may contract. After 10 to 15 minutes hypersensitivity returns with further convulsions. There may be one to 10 such attacks before recovery or death from respiratory arrest, otherwise known as suffocation. The fatal dose is usually in the range of 100 to 200 mg, but as little as 30 mg in adults and 15 mg in children has proven fatal.

This is a highly toxic substance. To talk about making it available in higher concentrations where it could impact on other parts of the population, both human and animal, is highly questionable.

On September 26, 2005, the Pest Management Regulatory Agency, PMRA, a branch of Health Canada, issued notice that it had re-evaluated the use of strychnine to control certain pest populations, such as northern pocket gophers, skunks, pigeons, wolves, coyotes and black bears, stating that evidence did not show that its use for these animals did not pose an unacceptable risk for human health or for the environment.

As I noted earlier, there had been some concerns around the PMRA process in taking a look at how it approves pesticides in Canada, and again, the fact that the regulations from the 2002 act have not been put in place.

However, the PMRA maintained that the use of strychnine to control ground squirrels like Richardson's, Columbian and Franklin was still a concern from an environmental perspective. It was agreeing that there was a concern around this. It issued a proposed acceptability for continued registration, PACR, which stated that due to the damage caused by ground squirrels and the lack of practical alternatives, it was recommending the continued use of strychnine for the next three years.

This proposal included a re-evaluation in three years, during which there would be work on an integrated pest management program for Richardson's ground squirrels by a group of stakeholders and some new regulations relating to enhanced labelling.

This problem has been going on for a number of years. Why has it taken so long to get adequate action for our farmers, so that they can protect their livelihoods without resorting to such a highly toxic substance.

The concerns of the PMRA were that the current use of strychnine resulted in appreciable amount of poisoned bait being available to non-target organisms, including songbirds. This is that old collateral damage. Let us call it what it is. Other creatures are dying because they are ingesting this poison and it was a use to which it was never intended.

Based on carcass counts, it was estimated that 1,950 songbirds were poisoned in southern Saskatchewan in the 2001 season. As well, a large number of poisoned carcasses would be available to predators and scavengers, including endangered species common to the area where strychnine is regularly used, like the swift fox and the burrowing owl.

The PMRA determined that new forms of bait and/or ways to reduce user reliance on strychnine need to be explored and we would concur. It is incumbent again upon the government to propose a solution that is going to meet the needs of the farmers and include farmers in this discussion.

John Worgan of the federal Pest Management Regulatory Agency said the long term plan is to look at phasing out the use of strychnine for gopher control, with a short term goal to reduce reliance on strychnine. Paul Laflamme, Alberta's director of pest management, said, “There is a danger someone's pet or kids will come into contact with strychnine bait that was put out for the squirrels”.

Clearly, we need to be concerned about the interrelatedness of our environment. The strychnine does not stop at the rodent. It gets into all kinds of other systems. We must find another way to help our farmers and support them in looking at different ways to deal with this rodent population. I urge members of this House to vote against this motion.