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Crucial Fact

  • His favourite word was federal.

Last in Parliament October 2010, as Bloc MP for Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia (Québec)

Won his last election, in 2008, with 38% of the vote.

Statements in the House

International Boundary Waters Treaty Act April 26th, 2001

Madam Speaker, first I will say that the Bloc Quebecois will not support Bill C-6 as introduced, not because we are opposed to the basic principle of the bill, which is to prohibit bulk water exports to other countries as well as bulk water transfers within the country, but for a very simple reason.

Natural resource management is the provinces' responsibility. Each province is responsible for managing its own water resources, which belong to its residents.

We can talk about a lot of things with regard to Bill C-6. For example, we can talk about groundwater. We already know that the drawing of water by certain companies in some regions of Canada creates problems for agriculture with soils and wells, as well as problems for residents of the area where underground water is being drawn.

In fact, we had problems in some regions in Quebec. People complained and some companies had to stop drawing water in certain areas.

The other major element for us in Quebec is that when we are talking about boundary waters we are obviously talking about the Great Lakes and the St. Lawrence River. The St. Lawrence River flows across Quebec and its importance is well known. For the past several years, especially in certain areas such as Lake Champlain and the lakes around the St. Lawrence, water levels have dropped so dramatically that shipping may be at risk. Therefore it is extremely important for us to be able to conserve and manage as we see fit this resource which belongs to us.

There is another issue. When we talk about bulk water exports we should remember that it might involve not small quantities, but huge quantities of water. Currently there is no treaty to really protect us against bulk water exports.

A few years ago, in view of the problems that were occurring especially in the southern United States, there was already talk here in Canada about the possibility of exporting water in bulk through a pipeline carrying water from the north, namely Canada, to the United States.

This is a major point and I am not sure that as a country we would be better protected by Bill C-6. I am not sure that in the future Bill C-6 will make it impossible to export bulk water.

The vision this government should have for the future in agreement with the provinces and while staying out of their areas of jurisdiction should be to legislate a true ban supported by international treaties, which would provide us with a real protection.

The pressure to export water will increase in the future. The pressure will increase in view of the water shortage in some countries, especially the United States, our southern neighbours.

Currently the danger if water is misused or if we try to export it is that it will result in the desertification of certain areas and harm crops and agriculture in a big way. As we know, some western provinces are already experiencing problems with soil erosion and desertification.

Barely 15 or 20 years ago a Senate committee published a report on this. It dealt with desertification of soils in the western provinces, particularly due to a lack of water, a lack of rain and climate change.

Another very important element that has an impact on the quantity and quality of our water resources is the gradual disappearance of our forests. They play a role in terms of water retention, cleaning the rain so to speak, and they are essential to the health of our lakes and rivers.

There are also the dangers of shipping. In Canada we do not have any real protection with regard to shipping, including on the St. Lawrence River, and we should not pretend that we do. We could be the victims of a major disaster considering the number of ships that go up the St. Lawrence River every day and the type of products some of them carry. Once they have reached the Great Lakes these products are then delivered to major industrial centres in the United States such as Detroit and Chicago.

I would remind the House that Quebec has always been a leader in the area of water treatment. I remember that in 1978, Marcel Léger, then minister of the environment, proposed to the government of Quebec a water cleanup program in which the government invested some $12 billion over the years. We were very much ahead of our time; we were visionaries so to speak.

In the early 1980s, when I was mayor of my home town and we were looking at cleaning up our waters, we figured that it would cost us about $2.8 million. People thought we were crazy because we wanted to clean up our waters, protect our drinking water and clean the water before we would send it back into nature.

At the time we were concerned about the pollution of our municipal sources of drinking water and even private sources of drinking water in some areas. It was a serious problem and still is, as we have seen recently.

Our drinking water supply is still in danger. We still have a lot of work to do to ensure that municipalities can provide quality drinking water to all Quebecers and Canadians. Consumer confidence is not what it used to be. That is quite obvious.

Also the bottled water industry is expanding and people no longer trust their own drinking water supply systems. They would rather drink bottled water.

This is an expanding market that some businesses would like to take over. We are talking about bottled water and not bulk water removal, but still bottled water export could set a precedent that would eventually open the door to bulk water exports.

When bulk water exports are involved consideration must also be given to the effects on our ecosystems, the economy and people's lives. Water, we will all agree, is vital to life and essential for humans, for all ecosystems, for animals, for nature and for our environment. It is an essential element. It is a resource that belongs to the community, and the community therefore needs assurance that we are protecting it.

It is absolutely vital that bulk water exports be banned, as the bill states. However agreement would first have to be reached on the principle of the bill, and we in the Bloc Quebecois are not in agreement with it. Although the protection of water resources is vitally important, as it stands Bill C-6 strikes us as risky and contrary to the way jurisdictions are divided between the federal and provincial governments.

In fact it has considerable potential of encroachment onto provincial areas of jurisdiction while not providing any additional protection against major water exports.

We have just experienced the Quebec city summit where negotiations were hidden, closed to the public, and civil society was denied access. This same type of negotiation could very easily take place in future on water exports, given the future needs that are going to develop, particularly with our neighbours to the south who as we know are far bigger and far stronger economically.

I have already mentioned the risks to navigation. This is very important to me. The federal government ought to address this matter since it is its responsibility, particularly in the St. Lawrence.

As I said, we are not disaster-proof. It is entirely possible that one day or other in the St. Lawrence catastrophes will occur such as we have seen in Europe, especially in northern Spain and northern Europe.

It would really be a major catastrophe and could affect an entire population, nearly 7 million people in Quebec, living in large part on the shores of the St. Lawrence.

Water represents an inestimable resource for humans. It is commonplace, as I said earlier, to want to protect its export. We have to remember that water has great potential in export terms and the demand will increase. It is vital to prevent its export.

The federal government announced in early 2000 that it intended to intervene more directly in the matter of water export and introduced a three pronged strategy.

This strategy follows from a motion passed in the House of Commons on water protection, which was introduced on February 9, 1999.

There are three parts to the strategy: changes to the International Boundary Waters Treaty Act in order to give the federal government regulatory powers over bulk removal of boundary waters; a joint reference with the United States to the International Joint Commission to investigate the effects of consumption, diversions and removals including those for export purposes in boundary waters; and a proposal to develop, in co-operation with the provinces and territories, a Canada-wide accord on bulk water removal so as to protect Canadian water basins.

On February 10, 1999, Canada and the United States appointed the International Joint Commission. After noting a growing number of proposals to export water from the Great Lakes and other areas of the U.S. and Canada, the two countries agreed to ask the commission to study the question and make recommendations within the next year. An interim report was presented on August 18, 1999, and the commission presented its final report on February 22, 2000.

In it's interim report the International Joint Commission recommended that during the six months it would need to complete its study the federal and provincial governments and the American states not authorize any removal or large scale sale of water.

It pointed out a number of things that warrant mentioning. It indicated that there was no surplus in the Great Lakes system, that large scale removal of water could limit the resilience of the system and that information on the removal of underground water was inadequate.

This point causes problems because, as I said earlier, underground waters can have a considerable effect on the integrity and quality of ecosystems.

The report pointed out as well that we do not know what the demand will be for water in the future. Also, because of the possible climate change and other natural considerations, it is impossible to assess with any degree of certainty what the level and the flow of the Great Lakes will be in the years to come.

In its final report, released in February 2000 and entitled “Protection of the Waters of the Great Lakes”, the commission concluded that we must protect the Great Lakes, particularly in light of the cumulative uncertainties, pressures and repercussions from water removal and use, demographic and economic growth, and climate change.

The report includes the following conclusions:

The water of the Great Lakes is a critical resource. On an average annual basis less than 1% of the water in the Great Lakes system is renewable, which says a lot.

If all interests in the basin are considered, there is never a surplus of water in the Great Lakes system; every drop of water has several potential uses.

International trade law obligations, including the provisions of the Canada—United States Free Trade Agreement, NAFTA, WTO agreements and the GATT do not prevent Canada and the United States from taking measures to protect their water resources and preserve the integrity of the Great Lakes basin ecosystem.

To the extent that decision makers do not discriminate against individuals from other countries in implementing these measures, Canada and the United States cannot be forced by trade laws to jeopardize the waters of the Great Lakes ecosystem.

Let us note, however, as I mentioned earlier, that no such agreement may override international treaties. It will therefore be possible to challenge such a measure, i.e. the one we have before us, under the treaties which have been signed, and these obviously include the FTAA, NAFTA and so forth. These are overriding treaties with respect to this sort of measure to protect drinking water.

In its final report the BAPE sums up its conclusions as follows. The overall diagnosis is relatively clear. The current approach to water and aquatic ecosystem management is sector based, poorly integrated and not concerned enough with protecting the resource.

The shift must be made to integrated management practices that are more harmonized at the government level, balanced protection and enhancement objectives, and be purposely implemented at the river basin level. Furthermore, action can and must be taken now along the lines of the coming policy.

The BAPE's recommendations indicate that the Quebec government should approve the proposed policies for protecting and conserving groundwater and pass the related regulations, provided that projects involving the removal of more than 75 cubic metres of groundwater a day are subject to the environmental impact assessment and review procedure.

Recommendation No. 4 explains in particular that the Quebec government should make the Water Resources Preservation Act, which bans bulk exports of groundwater and surface water, permanent legislation. The commission is of the opinion that bulk exports need to be forbidden by law and no chances taken, with the uncertainties of international trade agreements such as NAFTA, WTO and the like.

In chapter 1.1 of the BAPE report reference is made to the federal government's position that NAFTA does not apply to water and bulk exports, which is being strongly disputed by a number of environmental groups, as the commission points out in its report.

BAPE also explains its position because, before bowing to such a request which at first blush is certainly appealing, it feels it would be best to examine NAFTA as a whole to determine what Canada has to gain and what it has to lose by renegotiating it. This goes beyond the mandate of the present commission.

In short, what BAPE wants us to understand is that it is very risky at this time to undertake a procedure such as the one the federal government is embarking on, given the fact that international agreements may take precedence over a bill such as this one.

In conclusion, as I have already said, the Bloc Quebecois will not be in favour of Bill C-6 for a number of reasons, including one major one: the bill encroaches on provincial areas of jurisdiction.

Fisheries April 6th, 2001

Mr. Speaker, in order to settle the dispute between the Quebec and Newfoundland fishers over the Greenland turbot, the minister has mandated a group of three experts to provide him with recommendations.

The experts from Newfoundland and New Brunswick recommend that Newfoundland be given a share of Quebec's traditional quota, while the Quebec expert proposes increasing Quebec's share.

Which recommendation does the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans intend to follow, the one from the maritimes experts, who again propose to trample on Quebec interests, or the one from the Quebec expert?

Financial Consumer Agency Of Canada Act March 30th, 2001

Madam Speaker, I heard my colleague from Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques talking about community reinvestment.

In my region and my riding, we have just experienced the closing of two branches of a major financial institution in two important centres, Matane and Amqui.

I would like to ask him a question on a point that I am very interested in, because these two regions are going through a crisis at this time. What happens when a financial institution leaves a town with bank accounts, with depositors' money, and transfers this money to another town? What does it mean for a town to lose a significant amount of money, a lot of capital, when it is already in a difficult financial situation?

I ask my colleague to elaborate.

Gaspé Region March 30th, 2001

Mr. Speaker, everything appears just dandy in the Saguenay—Lac-Saint-Jean region, but it is far from the case in the Gaspé.

Despite the apparent impatience of the member for Bonaventure—Gaspé—Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Pabok with the time it is taking Canada Economic Development to release funds from its special program in the Gaspé region, he and the minister refused to take part in a debate on this very subject yesterday on Radio-Canada.

How does the minister and Secretary of State responsible for the Economic Development Agency of Canada for the Regions of Quebec intend to remedy the situation and provide the funds from this program in the Gaspé?

Supply March 15th, 2001

Madam Speaker, I would like to use my time to assert the importance of the forest as a resource and of its harvesting by the softwood lumber industry for an area like the riding of Matapédia—Matane.

Considering the makeup of my riding, I will divide my speech into two parts and talk about the situation and the issues for two separate regions, namely the lower St. Lawrence area and the Gaspé peninsula. These are two huge areas that I represent, along with one of my colleagues on the other side of the House.

On April Fool's Day, we stand to be made fools of by the Americans.

The softwood lumber agreement which has been in force since 1996, will expire on March 31. I think we should consider our past, present and future situation in order to avoid the problems we have had before with the United States.

For the next few minutes I will try to illustrate the situation in areas similar to my riding. The hon. member for Beauce stated earlier that 1,000 residents in his riding will be affected by the softwood lumber agreement. In my riding, I have 2,000 people working in the industry.

This goes to show that any action taken in an industry like the forest industry must be well targeted, because it can have a serious impact on communities like mine that have already been hard hit, for instance, by the downturn in the fishery.

We in the Bloc Quebecois have realized how detrimental the current softwood lumber agreement is and, as a famous politician recently put it, how harmful it is to the Quebec industry. Some might say barbaric, but I think that word has not been properly used in the last little while.

Let me review the current situation as seen by the forest industry commission of the Gaspé Peninsula—Îles-de-la-Madeleine regional consultation and development council, a group of stakeholders who truly believe in the development of our forest industry.

Our forests, a natural resource once thought to be inexhaustible, are and remain very vulnerable from many points of view.

Nature itself and human activity did play a role and still do. They are very important change factors. We should use good judgment and foresight. In other words, we should be very careful, because the forest industry is just as vulnerable as the natural resource is.

We find two bioclimatic zones in the Gaspé peninsula. The peninsula is surrounded by fir forests with a mixed stand of yellow birch and softwood trees like the balsam fir, white spruce and white cedar.

The two main harmful elements are spruce budworm infestations and fire. They obviously have an impact on the lumber industry.

The other bioclimatic zone is the middle of the peninsula. It is made of fir forests with white birch stands. Here, we have stands of balsam fir, white spruce and white birch. The ground is usually very rugged.

Therefore it is quite false to suggest that the lumber industry in my area has an advantage compared to the American industry, because of our harsh climate and rough land.

My region is almost totally covered with forests: they take up 96% of the land. People in my area say things like: “I was raised in the woods”. Some 87% of this forest is publicly owned. It is mostly made up of softwood stands, 48%, or mixed stands, 33%. Standing volumes mostly contain the following species: fir, spruce, birch and trembling aspen. Obviously these are all species that are affected by the softwood lumber agreement.

Nearly two-thirds of the stands are considered young, being 50 years old or less, even though more than 17% of the forest is made up of stands over 90 years old.

As for the privately owned forest, it covers a 383,000 hectare area 95% of which is made up of small private properties, meaning properties of about 800 hectares or less, the other 5% being made up of large private properties. This area occupies a very narrow stretch of land on the periphery of the peninsula, the width of which varies between 2 and 20 kilometres.

The main benefits from the forest in the Gaspé area come from the management and harvesting of the forest biomass, which, as we know, is affected by the softwood lumber agreement. The largest part of the region's publicly owned forest is subdivided into management units, and available timber volumes are allocated to processors through harvesting and forest management contracts.

Despite this industrial use of the forest, other users such as hunters, fishers and vacationers can also enjoy the forest and its various resources. All this to show that the logging industry is very important to a riding like Matapédia—Matane.

This industry employs nearly 2,000 people, as I was saying earlier, which accounts for more than 45% of primary sector jobs in the region. This means that any change to the softwood lumber agreement will have disastrous consequences on a region such as mine. The four logging co-operatives in the Gaspé Peninsula are concentrated in the Baie-des-Chaleurs area. They employ nearly 500 people.

As for the five logging groups, they are spread out throughout the peninsula and employ more than 600 people. Add to that some 15 logging contractors, two nurseries, four consultants and seven forestry advisors.

Management activities on publicly owned woodlots are financed through timber royalties, contrary to claims made by the Americans, and paid by individual operators based on their allotted volumes. These royalties are also used to fund activities related to the forest resource development program.

For example, in 1996-97 close to $22 million were paid in timber royalties, stumpage fees, et cetera. in our region alone. Of this amount, $8 million were used to fund regular forest management activities.

Over 80 wood processing companies employ nearly 2,000 people, which represents 26% of jobs in the manufacturing sector.

There are two cardboard and paper mills, one of which, Gaspésia in Chandler, is currently shut down. There is a recovery plan in the works and, if I may say so, federal aid is still not forthcoming. In the Gaspé there are also 19 sawmills covered by timber supply and forest management agreements and more than 60 sawmills in operation.

According to the forest sectoral commission of the regional consultation and development council, which is made up of various stakeholders from the forestry sector, there are three main issues at stake: to preserve and create direct and indirect forest sector jobs, which is almost impossible without a free trade agreement; to improve the skills needed in the Gaspé forest sector to ensure full and comprehensive economic and social development; and to promote integrated management of all our forest resources in order to protect our resources.

The regional consultation and development council has also prepared a brief on the situation in the lower St. Lawrence area, which I would like to briefly review for the House since my time is running out.

Populated areas and the physical environment join together in great surroundings where nature is everywhere and influences every aspect of daily life. Nature dominates in several different ways. One quarter of our municipalities are along the St. Lawrence estuary. Various crops are cultivated on cutover marine terraces and the gentle slopes of the valleys. On the north-east side, mixed forests can still be found on the Appalachian plateau.

The region's development relies therefore on the development and sustainability of our natural resources. Public expectations are very high. It urges us to strive for excellence, as we have done in the past and will continue to do so, for instance, with our high performance sawmills. This is probably what irks the Americans the most. Despite our climate and our situation, we are still able to perform and compete with them on their own turf.

However, the need to take into account national and international concerns about sustainable development further reinforces this idea. The challenge to excel that we must pursue forces us in a way to raise the bar of our ambitions and to aspire to become a reference in the area of natural resources protection and use. And that we have already achieved to a great extent.

The forest environment includes the land, the resources it contains, the multiple uses that are made of it and the relationship between the human beings and the natural environment in which they live. From now on, the values and aspirations of the people of the lower St. Lawrence, combined with the national and international concerns, must govern the protection and use of the local forest environment.

Sustainable development and biodiversity are at the heart of the forest resources protection goal.

Our area has to become a model. It already is one. We now have to promote the great potential of those sites while aiming at optimum production. As I was saying at the very beginning of my remarks, 2,000 jobs are affected in the Matapédia—Matane riding. I wonder what the Americans will do when the time comes to negotiate a lumber agreement after the free trade area of the Americas has become a reality.

Aquaculture March 2nd, 2001

Mr. Speaker, Quebec has created the Société de recherche et développement en aquaculture, investing $300,000 in it specifically for research into freshwater aquaculture.

This research should lead to new avenues for the groundfishers hit by the loss of certain species and the negligence of Fisheries and Oceans Canada.

Could the minister of fisheries confirm in the House his intention to respond affirmatively to the request by the Quebec minister of fisheries that he invest an equivalent sum in this research fund, that—

Softwood Lumber February 23rd, 2001

Mr. Speaker, the minister says he hopes for a return to free trade with the United States as regards softwood lumber.

If this is true, is the minister prepared to support a motion from all members of the House simply asking that Americans go back to free trade and nothing else?

Softwood Lumber February 23rd, 2001

Mr. Speaker, yesterday, on the issue of softwood lumber, the Minister for International Trade told the House, and I quote, we hope “that we are headed toward free trade, and we want to make sure that—we will have a smooth transition to free trade”.

The minister's wishy-washy approach puts Canada in a vulnerable position in its negotiations with the United States.

Can the minister tell us what he meant yesterday when he used the word “transition”, if not that he is considering negotiating other quotas to please the Atlantic provinces and the United States, at the expense of Quebec producers of softwood lumber?

Oil Heating Prices February 9th, 2001

Mr. Speaker, nothing has been resolved. The situation is still the same. When is the government going to abandon its short term approach and come up with a genuine policy on competition?

Oil Heating Prices February 9th, 2001

Mr. Speaker, a few weeks before the election was called, the government decided to send out $125 rebate cheques, supposedly to offset the increase in the price of heating oil for needy Canadians. It is obvious that this hastily thought up scheme to get more votes has done nothing to improve matters.

My question for the Minister of Finance is this: Does the minister realize that, far from being a lasting solution, his vote getting scheme had no other purpose than to portray him as sympathetic to voters, especially those in the greatest need?