Mr. Speaker, first, I must say that I feel the previous speaker from the Canadian Alliance has really skewed the question.
The question is not whether we are for or against job protection and creation; we are all in favour of job creation prior to bankruptcy. Once bankruptcy has been declared, however, there is no more discussion of job creation. The question instead is how the liquidated assets are going to be divided between the banks and the workers, between those who are making record profits that are even an embarrassment, even to shareholders, and those in need of money quite simply to support their families.
The question has been skewed, and the response the hon. member for Winnipeg Centre was seeking has not been obtained. I congratulate him for introducing this bill and share his regret that it is not a votable item.
Will pay owing to workers have precedence over the financial institutions, or will it not? The Bloc Quebecois' answer to this is yes. We agree with Bill C-203 that the order of creditor priority must be changed when a business goes bankrupt, so that pay to salaried and other employees takes top priority when assets are being divided.
In my eight years as secretary general of the Confédération des syndicats nationaux I heard of many sad cases. I will name three only: the bankruptcy of the Coopérants, the bankruptcy of Crowne Plaza, on the west side of Sherbrooke Street; there are two Crowne Plazas in Montreal, the other one is on the east side of Sherbrooke; and the bankruptcy of Papiers Saint-Raymond.
In each case, workers who had devoted much of their life to developing the business ended up penalized because, with the liquidation of its assets, the company was unable to meet its salary and pension obligations, in particular. These were unionized workers. The CSN spent time and energy pursuing the company directors under Quebec and federal laws in order to recover some money. It took time. At times we were unable to obtain everything due them.
Unfortunately, these unionized workers are still a minority in the labour force. In the case of Quebec, only 40% of the labour force is unionized and in Canada, the figure is a little less than 35%. Legislation is needed to re-establish a balance, if I can put it that way, so that workers, the employees of the company, are the first to be paid when assets are liquidated.
Why should they be paid first? Because they are often the victims of the errors made by employer and directors. Unfortunately in Canada and Quebec we are still not entitled to economic information that will help employees. They are, in the end, at the mercy of a decision that may have been made in all good faith. I do not doubt that. I do not think many employers, I have known some who did it for anti-union motives, but they are the exception, made a conscious decision to lead their business to bankruptcy, but it can happen.
Workers are adversely affected by these errors in judgment in that they lose their jobs. If they also lose the salaries owed to them, it is a double whammy.
There is also the ability to shoulder the loss of income. As I said earlier and I will say it again, banks make profits which, in my opinion, are obscene. These profits are made at the expense of both businesses and consumers. The Canadian Federation of Independent Business complains about the treatment that its members are getting from major Canadian banks and others.
Given their record profits and the instruments they have at their disposal, banks are able to put up with losses that workers cannot shoulder, because it is the future of their families and their own retirement which are at stake.
In theory, I underline in theory, when financial institutions lend money, they take a risk. Their payoff for that risk is the rate of interest they charge. Interest rates are very real and they are still too high. Banks have the means to assess the risk. These financial institutions take risks and it would only be normal that they come after the workers.
Under Bill C-203, it is not guaranteed, as the hon. member rightly pointed out, that all the debts owed to workers would be paid back.
In this respect, Canada should follow up on convention 173 of the International Labour Organization and sign this convention adopted in 1992, precisely to protect, just as Bill C-203 seeks to do, the debts owed to workers, to ensure that they are compensated for their salaries, pensions and other types of benefits, following a bankruptcy.
Convention 173 also proposes the creation of an independent fund to which all employers would contribute so as to ensure that not only would workers head the list of creditors, but should an insolvent employer be unable to pay their wages and pensions by liquidating its assets, the fund could be used to ensure that workers were not penalized.
All Quebec's labour unions, the CSN, the FTQ, the CSD and the CSQ, are in agreement with the principle of Bill C-203. As a representative of the Quebec people and of their interests, I have an obligation to support this bill.
It is very hard for me to understand why the government members keep telling us about the extremely generous values to which Canada subscribes when the country is refusing to sign ILO convention 173.
It always seems to be the same old story with the present federal government, the Liberal government. It always has its left turn signal on, but it always turns right. At least with the Alliance, things are clear: always a right turn signal and always headed to the right.
I have had enough of this hypocrisy, and I want to assure this parliament that, in the interest of the Quebec people, in the interest of the workers of Quebec and Canada, we are always going to support measures of the sort found in Bill C-203. Once again, I congratulate the member for Winnipeg Centre on his initiative.
