Industry committee  Thank you. The loss of the court challenges program has had an impact on people with disabilities and other disadvantaged groups across the county in many different fora, but of concern for your hearings is that currently at the CRTC the public interest nature of groups like ours and Ms.

Industry committee  Well, it will have a big effect on litigants across the country, both from French-language point of view—

Industry committee  I just have a quick comment. I like the ombudsman idea for individual complaints, but I'm not certain that the ombudsman idea in the report goes far enough to deal with systemic concerns. I think we still need, from the point of view of social regulation and net neutrality--those kinds of concerns--an oversight body that has power to make orders in a systemic way.

Industry committee  What's the effect of the court challenges program?

Industry committee  I have a pertinent comment that's not with respect to—

Industry committee  There have been some that have been looked after, but only subsequent to the CRTC ordering it.

Industry committee  Yes, they're hard now.

Industry committee  You need a light and bigger print, right?

Industry committee  There is some stuff primarily out of the United States. Since they're our closest partner, I would recommend seriously looking at the Access Board and at setting up an independent agency such as the United States Access Board. There are also those two statutes that I mentioned, section 225 of the Communications Act of 1934, and section 508 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973.

Industry committee  To be frank, I'm not too familiar with the American example, except that I have been to several international telecommunications conferences dealing with accessibility. Bar none, the fellow from Microsoft, the last national director for Microsoft, was saying that the most important thing in the United States has been section 508 of the Rehabilitation Act, in terms of the requirement that the American government only procures, uses, and purchases equipment—and it's not only in telecommunications, because it's broader than telecom—that meets a very high level of standards.

Industry committee  From our point of view, you'd have to say it's the companies that don't want to provide it, or that it's a bother. It's not that they don't really care about people with disabilities, it's just that we're a tack-on. There have been 38 decisions at the CRTC dealing with disability.

Industry committee  I come from the province that still believes in legal aid. Legal Aid Ontario funds 79 legal clinics, and the ARCH Disability Law Centre is one of the specialty clinics. So 90% to 95% of our budget comes from legal aid. We have a small amount from the City of Toronto that pays half a support person.

Industry committee  It hasn't proved to be the case for disability. It may be that there are many different kinds of disabilities, so one adjustment or one accommodation doesn't fit all. I'd like to look at a situation slightly outside of telecom. When you use your bank card at an automatic teller, people who are blind regularly ask the person beside them for help and give them their pin number and ask if they'll help them do their banking, because the banking industry just simply has not come across yet.

Industry committee  I think your question is won't the market just follow the aging boomer population?

Industry committee  If I might, I think that it's not only the economic impact, but it's also the access impact for people with disabilities. It's both issues.