Agriculture committee  About two-thirds of what we produce in western Canada is exported out by rail right now. Every bushel that goes into ethanol could arguably be one less bushel we have to export. The larger we grow it.... I don't have the exact number; we can maybe see the numbers we're going to have, but every bushel we take out is one less bushel on which we pay the rail freight to port position.

Agriculture committee  Yes, the Don O'Connor study. I made a note here. We'll get that to the committee.

Agriculture committee  Thank you. He touched on the biodiesel part from the Grain Growers; I'll just touch on some ethanol thoughts. I have five brief reasons why we are happy to see an ethanol industry develop and why we would support Bill C-33. Number one—and I'm speaking more from a western Canadian perspective—it reduces our dependency on foreign grain markets; in western Canada we're heavily dependent on exporting, and when you're exporting your grain offshore, you're vulnerable to tariff, non-tariff barriers, currency fluctuations, labour disputes, and ocean freight rates.

Agriculture committee  Actually, that flagged an issue. Thank you for the question. It actually follows up with Mrs. Skelton's question as well. We recently met with the Canadian Association of Agri-Retailers. They were talking about some of the new regulations and provisions for security that are coming in around fertilizer sites, and the costs.

Agriculture committee  Just following upon that, one thing we've discussed but which we haven't put forward as a formal proposal was whether cash advances could be moved ahead and made earlier, so that you could take advantage, because even if the fertilizer price is going up, there are local over-supplies from here to there, and there are buying opportunities for producers, who can save significant dollars—more than the cost of borrowing and the cost of capital to do it.

Agriculture committee  I think I'd concur. I'm not sure we can regulate. For every regulation government creates, farmers will find a way around it--that's just kind of the nature of the beast--or other business people find ways around it. Some of the work we've done is on harmonizing and opening the borders so there's more price transparency back and forth.

Agriculture committee  Yes, we could be a lot tougher yet. We'd be glad to put a submission in to you at a later date on some of the things. I think you would find a lot of the groups signing on to that sort of issue.

Agriculture committee  No.

Agriculture committee  Go ahead and ask your question first.

Agriculture committee  We also want to comment on the transportation, as to what exactly you can do. I think what we need to see is a level of service review, both for the industrial shippers but also for the grain shippers. That costs, just on the income side, certainly western Canadian farmers. There are premium sales out there in the world, but people can't book those sales because we can't be sure to get the railcars, the engines, and the crews to get stuff to port in time for those sales.

Agriculture committee  I'm not sure I have the wisdom of the people around this table on that one. I guess that would take some study and work on what exactly the barriers are. Is there property out there that can be mined that's not being mined, and why isn't it? Are people holding onto properties and paying a charge just to keep it under their control so it can't be made available to other people?

Agriculture committee  What we don't know is are there other barriers out there? Why have there been no new entrants into the mining industry? Are there barriers out there that can be dealt with to get more competition? Because competition is what brings down the price. And I think FNA would fully agree with us on that one, Paul.

Agriculture committee  Just in closing on the fertilizer point, what we see is a huge demand for this fertilizer around the world, and as Canadian producers, we're going to be competing to keep those products here in Canada. What can the committee do? What can the government do? I think if there's anything that could be done to stimulate the production, if there are new mines that people are looking at, if there are incentives that could be put in place for more production....

Agriculture committee  Good morning. My name is Richard Phillips. I'm the executive director of the Grain Growers of Canada, and my wife and I still maintain a grain farm in Saskatchewan. With me today is a director of the Grain Growers of Canada, Mr. Leo Meyer. Leo is a grains and oilseeds farmer from the Peace River area.

Agriculture committee  When you ask how much money is needed, one of the problems for a lot of people in western Canada with the CAIS program is we actually can't predict clearly what the program covers, so it's really hard to know with any clarity what we would need when in many ways we don't know how it really works.