Industry committee  I sat on the Minister of Industry's national task force on spam, and we spent a lot of time in that year, as part of that task force, working with law enforcement at the Department of Justice, as well as the RCMP, trying to address the issue. I came to appreciate during that time just how hard it is to get the resources from the RCMP and Justice and law enforcement officials generally to turn their attention to some of these issues.

Industry committee  I think I'd agree with that, and I'd even go further, in a sense. If you buy a high-value item in a dollar store, let's say, or in a discount store, surely as a consumer you have some recognition that there is perhaps some risk associated with it. That's not to say it's a good thing when we see these incidents happen.

Industry committee  I think it's important to distinguish between different types of issues, because depending on the type of product, there may be different ways to try to obtain the data. For example, in the camcording area there are these wild numbers that, if true, mean the total's going to amount to about 500% of all global camcording being attributed to a series of places.

Industry committee  I too would focus on unauthorized copies that involve clear deception, particularly where we're talking about public health and safety. I'd note that while you may have seen, as you toured the country, fake auto parts and the like, the RCMP's own data suggests that the top sources for counterfeiting are actually watches, handbags, and items of that nature.

Industry committee  Chair, I have just a few things. You started by asking a question about how big a problem this is, and as I mentioned in my opening remarks, we don't know. So you will hear of many stock horror stories about the problems associated with counterfeiting, but there has not been in this country any independent data from someone who is truly reliable in this area to give us a sense of how much it actually does affect us.

Industry committee  I'd at least like to respond to your first comment about fake pharmaceuticals, just to make sure my comments are clear. I first noted that I felt health and safety issues were the top priority on this particular file. When I suggest there was only one such incident, I'm quoting the RCMP.

Industry committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. Good afternoon. My name is Michael Geist. I'm a law professor at the University of Ottawa, where I hold the Canada research chair in Internet and e-commerce law. I'm also a syndicated weekly columnist on law and technology for the Toronto Star and the Ottawa Citizen.

Industry committee  Well, sure, the TPR report refers to this issue as well, and they talk about the development of what they call U-CAN to provide universal access across the country to broadband connectivity. So the TPR report, if you take the time to ensure that you address all the various issues beyond just mere deregulation, addresses many of the sorts of things that I was talking about here today.

Industry committee  I think there was reference to it just now, and I think it has proven to be a largely successful model. But I don't think it's the only one, and I think that as we start to see an increasing number of municipalities engage in Muni Wi-Fi and the like, there are a number of different models we could look to.

Industry committee  That's the conclusion of the TPR report. They did an analysis and took a fairly aggressive approach in assuming that the market would fill in wherever viable, but they still reached the conclusion that a sizeable percentage of Canadians will never have access. The marketplace simply isn't there for them.

Industry committee  It will. There are a number of different possibilities. One is to look to the various municipalities and local towns and provide them with the necessary support to try to create municipally owned infrastructure to ensure they have broadband. Another is to simply invest the money necessary at the federal level to ensure that all communities across the country have that kind of access.

Industry committee  I think we're going to see a growing digital divide in our own country. Only a few years ago Canada was ranked second globally in broadband access. I believe the most recent ranking had us dropping out of the top ten. Unless something is put in place, there's every reason to think we're going to continue to drop further.

Industry committee  I would only note that the scenario I just heard described really does rely heavily on Vonage and some of these other third-party providers coming forward. That's one of the reasons why net neutrality advocates are so concerned, because if you're creating a system whereby you're really looking to these third-party providers as a critical component in terms of the overall competitive marketplace, there is an incentive built in for the cable company, as we've already seen in other ISPs, to try to block access to those services because they've got the customer built in, and the technology makes it easy to ensure that you can keep Vonage out if you really wanted to.

Industry committee  I think it's opportune at a minimum, given that there's a move towards deregulation. It's the sort of thing we know the large providers are anxious to obtain. A net neutrality provision as part of that would probably be seen as a worthwhile price to pay as part of the broader deregulation.

Industry committee  The TPR report recognized the issue of net neutrality and raised it as a concern, and it talked about the concern particularly around blocking content and applications. If you're looking for justification from the report, it's already in there. As long as we take a full approach in terms of trying to deal with all the issues recognized by the TPR report, there's every reason to move forward on the issue.