Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  The public office holder is in an executive capacity. The member of Parliament is in a legislative capacity, a different function.

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  The commissioner may be asked to investigate a matter. He may come to the view that there is a conflict under the code. Then he may issue an order to recuse on all matters having relation to that interest. I don't know how broad the Ethics Commissioner's definition might be of what is a relationship or relevant, or how narrow it might be.

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  Mr. Chair, to go from the theoretical to the practical is not easy in this domain. I dare say that ought not diminish the importance of the theoretical here. These principles have served the system well, over centuries. I don't know that I can answer your question, Mr. Owen, in terms of “as if by operation”.

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  It's a draft. Okay. It is proposed in this letter that the inconsistency or anomaly that's identified, and properly so, where an exemption or an exception is given to ministers but not to members of Parliament, could be corrected by simply making reference to its provision in the code in subsection 41.3(3) of what will become a provision in the Parliament of Canada Act.

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. Ms. Melanie Mortensen, a lawyer in my office, has been working with me on this file, so I asked, with your indulgence, to be accompanied before the committee today by Ms. Mortensen. I notice you announced the purpose of this meeting as being to do with disclosure forms, but I had the impression, from what we received from the clerk of the committee, that our mandate was a bit larger than simply disclosure forms.

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  Do you want me to continue, Mr. Chair?

Subcommittee on Disclosure Forms under the Conflict of Interest Code committee  The theme of our presentation to the committee back in late May 2006 was that there are privileges that apply to the House of Commons and its members that ought to be kept in mind when legislation is going through Parliament, and there were provisions in the bill that we thought were incursions into those privileges.

Public Accounts committee  What's the question, Mr. Chairman?

Public Accounts committee  Thank you, Mr. Chairman. What's the question?

Public Accounts committee  The term “conflict of interest”, Mr. Chairman, is used in a variety of contexts. One of those contexts is the code of conflict of interest for members of Parliament. That, however, deals with private interests, as against the larger public interest. A lawsuit, as such, isn't a private interest in the sense that the code contemplates members having private interests.

Veterans Affairs committee  I'll pass it on, but let me just say this and give Melanie a chance to think about it. Remember, Prime Minister Diefenbaker brought in his Canadian Bill of Rights, and “bill of rights” as an expression—

Veterans Affairs committee  Well, I do, and it was spoken of in great and large terms, because “the Bill of Rights” is a phrase in American legal and political culture that has sacrosanct standing. We have the Magna Carta, and we have the Bill of Rights Act, 1689, in Britain, that's part of our Constitution in Canada.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, but some veterans probably won't live long enough to get through all that. That process of boards and courts and all the rest of it, for goodness' sake, can take a long time.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, not to mention the dollars.

Veterans Affairs committee  You have to remember that the legislative process and the regulatory process are quite separate, so who is “we” here? If it's the government, obviously the government can change its regulations faster than it can change the law, in terms of going through the process in the House and in the Senate.