Procedure and House Affairs committee  I'm talking about parliamentary principles here. My role is not to judge under what circumstances these principles should apply or anything else of that nature. I am only commenting on the principles. I hope I am making myself clear as regards the principles involved in this affair; however, when it comes to the way they should apply, that is a decision for you to make as members of this committee.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  I believe your comment is relevant, but Mr. Lukiwski may also make a relevant comment. I'm waiting to hear it.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  I heard that question asked many times by members in committee sitting on the opposition side during the years when there was a majority government. It happens that way: too bad, so sad, you don't have the numbers; the government shows up at committee having decided its view on an issue and that view prevails.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  No, not at all.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  Yes, you're right.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  That is a very broad question. In the public domain, there are debates about access to public information and government information. That is the issue under discussion here: access for members of Parliament to government information to help them carry out their parliamentary duties.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  That's correct.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  Here we are talking about a question of privilege raised against the government. One option would be to say that the government has acted in a manner that is contrary to the privileges of the House of Commons, period—or a motion could be introduced stating that the House has lost confidence in the government, or you could criticize the government and leave it at that.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  I don't want to put words in the Speaker's mouth. I do not know specifically what the Speaker had in mind, but I believe that, according to his interpretation of the situation, the government had decided not to provide the documents to the House of Commons. As a reasonable man, he believes that an explanation should be given as to the reason why documents are not being provided to Parliament.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  Yes.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  Not now, because I would have to examine the bill.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  Could you repeat that again?

Procedure and House Affairs committee  You can vote on anything you may choose to vote on, I suppose. The question is whether that's the appropriate route to take when the information you're seeking pertains to a particular bill before the House. One might suggest you vote against the legislation. On the other hand, you may vote against the legislation and still think your privileges are being breached, and you still may want to pursue the privilege point because there's a principle here.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  The onus is on the government to comply with Speakers' rulings for the purposes of parliamentary business, correct.

Procedure and House Affairs committee  In legal terms, documents and information that come into the hands of members of Parliament in their capacity as members of a House committee--and I said this earlier to another committee--are subject to whatever rules the committee might make about disclosure of those documents.