Public Accounts committee  Is this the employee vets? Is that what we're talking about?

Public Accounts committee  Each year the government records in its accounts an increase to reflect the cost, effectively, of pensions of the people who are employed by the government.

Public Accounts committee  Currently we have the lowest net debt ratio by far in the G-7. As you indicated, the IMF projects that while our debt ratio will go up somewhat—it's in the order of five percentage points measured in relation to gross domestic product—that's really quite a small increase compared to the massive increases that are taking place in virtually every other G-7 country.

Public Accounts committee  Canada's net debt through 2014 will be only slightly higher than it is now. Again, what we're talking about here is the total government net debt, so it is the combined federal-provincial net debt, plus the balances in the Canada and Quebec pension plans. It's calculated that way so we can compare across countries, many of which are unitary states.

Public Accounts committee  They would have debt ratios that are considerably larger than ours. I don't have that data right off the top of my head.

Public Accounts committee  We're doing well, and we're well below anybody else.

Public Accounts committee  Why don't I speak to that from the Department of Finance's perspective. In large measure, the deficit in 2008-09 reflects the onset of the recession. You see that when you look at budgetary revenues, particularly the large drop in corporate income tax revenues. You'll recall that the global recession really accentuated in the last quarter of 2008 and the first quarter of 2009.

Public Accounts committee  The debt service costs are projected to rise in part because interest rates are historically low right now, but it's also because we are taking on more debt. In September, the government sent out an update where it indicated an overall general approach to return to balance, and that approach was centred on controlling spending and reducing the overall growth rate in spending.

Public Accounts committee  The recession will have an enormous impact on the account. We foresee cumulated deficits of approximately $15 billion between 2009 and 2011. The 2009 contribution level was set at $1.73 for every $100 of taxable income under the account. The government froze the contribution level for 2010.

Public Accounts committee  Well, the last—

Public Accounts committee  There is a pattern in lapses. If one goes back, say, to the late 1990s, there is a pattern of increasing lapses from about 1999-2000 until 2007-08, and I would say that's largely a function of an expansion in spending over that period of time and of spending that takes some time to implement, either in an absolute sense, because they're federal programs that are being designed, or because they involve some partnership or negotiation with a third party—in particular, provinces and municipalities.