Veterans Affairs committee  That would be really tough for me to answer, because since 2006, when the organizational decision was made by senior management to not go the way of the new veterans charter, we haven't analyzed it. It would be outside my field of expertise to comment, and I would dare to say that those within the organization have probably not looked at it since 2006.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes and no. It would really depend on the issue. For example, the process within Veterans Affairs adjudicates our disability pension. We already go through them. They have the ability to appeal a decision and to be reassessed for a different issue. There's already that. The things that we hope would come to us, potentially, would be those one-offs that don't fall under the VAC mandate and don't fall under CPP or Great-West Life.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes, sure. What the chief is talking about are our child exploitation units and traffic reconstruction units. They're people who see the really, really tough stuff all the time. We also do psychological screening prior to applicants being accepted into the RCMP. One of the blind spots that I think a lot of organizations have is that there's not a lot known about how certain individuals obtain an operational stress injury.

Veterans Affairs committee  We have the member employee assistance program, which is not just for the members, but also for the families. It's not a counselling service, but it is a referral service through which we can send people to different areas they need. We don't have a family counselling centre as such, which would be a great idea.

Veterans Affairs committee  That's correct. On cases like those Mr. Stoffer was talking about, these tragic one-offs that occur, we don't have the capacity to build a system that's 100% foolproof.

Veterans Affairs committee  So what tends to occur is that it comes to someone's attention, whether it's an MP or a senior RCMP official within a division, and then at some point our chief human resources officer would likely be contacted. That would come back to the appropriate director general, whether that would be me, if it involved a health area, or compensation.

Veterans Affairs committee  That's for the top level.

Veterans Affairs committee  When talking about PTSD, as Chief Tousignant said, only within the last little have we really understood that although PTSD and operational stress injuries have been identified within the Canadian Forces and other military, those types of symptoms are also very prevalent in policing.

Veterans Affairs committee  Yes. Because we release at an older age, the softer things like re-education--vocational training or whatever kind of training--really didn't apply to us. Because our careers are longer and in a lot of cases very diverse, a lot of skills are picked up. When members are released, they have a lot of baggage from which to draw to get different employment outside.

Veterans Affairs committee  Does that answer where you're going or do you need more details of the actual scenarios that were run?

Veterans Affairs committee  I think it's important to know that Veterans Affairs is the one that administers the Pension Act, so anything that our members get under the Pension Act, they already have. It's one and the same for that aspect. Here's what we found in running the scenarios, which were in simple terms.

Health committee  Thanks. You're right about the critical incident stress management piece around certain specific instances, such as shootings or whatever, and I think we have a fairly good handle on that. What we don't have the handle on that we need presently, as Chief Superintendent Tousignant mentioned, is the pilot that started in January of this year.

Health committee  There are roughly 19,000. Our treatment needs go out to the community, so we look for both mental health issues and physical health issues to be done at the community level.

Health committee  I don't have that information before me.

Health committee  We don't have that information presently. As Staff Sergeant Brown said, I can tell you that we have a number of people who have applied for pensions through Veterans Affairs for an operational stress injury, but I don't have the number who are diagnosed with operational stress injuries.