Transport committee  I think there is a real risk in that for rural and remote communities or really any community anywhere that is interested in a type of project that investors are not interested in. What is that? Well, that's a small project in terms of capital costs, a project that is very risky, as we heard about.

Transport committee  This may be in a sense an age-old debate—in academia, anyway. To some extent it depends on how you define privatization, and I'm sorry to give that kind of answer. Which parts of the P3 are private? The land remains public, most often, in Canada. I think in every case I've ever looked at, the land remains a public asset.

Transport committee  I think what's happened is over time we have seen two waves—and scholars debate whether it's two waves or three waves—but let's just say it's two waves of P3s. There are ones that were developed in the nineties and early 2000s, that I think by any measure—a lot of them—were quite a disaster.

Transport committee  No problem; thanks for saying doctor. It's also professor, so I go by that. Thank you, though. In terms of other forms of financing, what is EDC doing? What is BDC doing? They're floating bonds. We bought a very expensive pipeline that way. So bonds are an option—or debt, let's say, which is why in my comments I focused on equity, which is, I think, fairly different.

Transport committee  Thank you. I have a lot to say about that. I'll just try to make it brief. I have spent over 10 years researching this and publishing on this. I would just say that I don't necessarily dispute the fact that P3s come in on time, on budget, though of course there are many exceptions to that, particularly P3s that were developed in the nineties and 2000s for various reasons.

Transport committee  Thanks. It does depend. Typically, in the case of some of these distressed cities that I was mentioning, it could be 99 years or it could be 50 years. These are typically agreements that take place over the course of multiple generations, so effectively it's in perpetuity. I haven't seen an example where it's fully relinquished, but 99 years is not uncommon.

Transport committee  If you don't mind, I'll read from my notes a little bit just to make sure I get the timeline right. Asset recycling, in case you're not familiar with it, can basically involve several things. Mainly it refers to disposing of so-called legacy assets in order to raise revenue that's needed for additional infrastructure.

Transport committee  Thanks very much for inviting me here today to comment on the mandate, activities, projects and financing of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. I've noted the types of witnesses that you have spoken to thus far—the advocate, the critic, the defenders—and I'm sure my answers will make clear where I fit here too.