Fisheries committee  Certainly on the issues faced in different regions, even as simple as there are different species involved in different regions, we need to ensure that the management of these species is second to none. We certainly face enough issues with the international reception of our seal harvest.

Fisheries committee  Absolutely. There are a few ongoing projects for removal of seals and sea lions in particular localities in the United States where there are already impediments to salmon and steelhead migration. They're often around hydro dams. What they see quite often is that you'll get to a point where a lot of fish are holding at the bottom of a hydro dam and all of a sudden a sea lion shows up.

Fisheries committee  Lethally remove—they will kill them.

Fisheries committee  No. To my understanding, they do not use the seal at all.

Fisheries committee  Thank you for the question. I think that, like you say, this is really around reframing the conversation. We have seen witnesses appear at this committee representing large fisheries organizations who I'm sure would not have accepted the invitation if this study had been held 10 years ago, because there was a time when it was impossible to have these conversations.

Fisheries committee  Absolutely. I'll yield the floor to Ms. Vaugeois to talk more about industry ambassadors.

Fisheries committee  I will say, much like your last question, that if there is demand in the market and if there is a profit motive—I'll put it that way—then sealing businesses, fur businesses, will reorganize themselves accordingly. Really what we need to do is to make sure that it's worth a sealer getting on the boat and heading out and onto the ice to go and take that seal, that it's worth it for a processing plant to process that seal into seal skin, oil and meat, and that it's worth it for the folks who sell those three products to do it.

Fisheries committee  Thanks, Mr. Arnold. I'll actually get my colleague Ms. Vaugeois to speak to this one.

Fisheries committee  Thank you, Mr. Arnold. Before joining the institute, I spent five years working for a large international conservation organization focusing on fisheries issues. The global conversation around ecosystem management of fisheries and whatever that means is certainly an ongoing one.

Fisheries committee  There is demand, but there is no market.

Fisheries committee  There's zero market.

Fisheries committee  The fur business writ large is a deeply globalized trade. We see product from Canada that moves into the United States that may move elsewhere. We, in fact, see more product move from the United States into Canada at a raw state. There is still somewhat significant fur manufacturing and fur garment production and sales in the United States.

Fisheries committee  It isn't and hasn't been since 1972 with the Marine Mammal Protection Act. The MMPA is fairly bulletproof when it comes to any Canadian seal product moving into the U.S.

Fisheries committee  Really, what would be required is work that is beginning, I will say, between DFO and harvester organizations in the gulf. The discussion around the harvesting of seals and sea lions in British Columbia would also require some knowledge transfer from commercial harvesters in Newfoundland, Îles de la Madeleine, Nunavut and Northwest Territories.

Fisheries committee  I think like any fishery, we can't go from zero to 60 in five seconds or less. This is something that would require a development of human capital and a development of infrastructure to get from where we are at today to even just reaching the total allowable catch for harp seals and grey seals, but it is something that the industry is ready for.