Foreign Affairs committee  Thank you, Dr. Fry, and thank you for saying we're old friends—

Foreign Affairs committee  —my having just retired from the Senate. There's no easy answer. In any situation, you can have influence and an impact on people, and short of military intervention, everything else is up for grabs. You want to use every lever you have to impress upon those who are committing the violations to stop; but if you can't stop them, then you look to accountability, and it is after the fact.

Foreign Affairs committee  My very brief.... I can follow up, if you want, in writing later. It opens more issues than it closes. Following on just one point—and that is coordination on all of this—we have to keep in mind that some of the activity and the actors in sanctions are not like Russia and Ukraine.

Foreign Affairs committee  When this bill started—l'll go back to that, and I'm not a psychologist—I know there was resistance to the Magnitsky bill, because it was a whole new topic, a whole new area that would need to be explored. There is a hesitancy to start new ventures. That is why this bill.... All the people who helped me sat down and said it's a starting point.

Foreign Affairs committee  Just quickly, I would hope the government would pay attention to the recommendations out of the Senate committee, which I was not involved in making, and this committee, as in the past. That would be my first step. Second, I think to have it go ahead is to understand what implementation will mean when we get to the level beyond seizure.

Foreign Affairs committee  I think it's being studied, to answer your question directly. This is the field that I and others are starting to look at in terms of how we can make sure there is accountability. I'd refresh everyone's memory that in some of the original bills that came through and did not pass, it was a reporting mechanism directly to Parliament—disclosure and involvement.

Foreign Affairs committee  I'll start midstream. I think from the start, any sanctions that have been imposed anywhere take time, as has been said. They, in themselves, will not move a marker on any autocratic leader who decides to go a certain way. It should be noted that there's a military response, and there's a sanctions response.

Foreign Affairs committee  Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will look to you to cut me off, because the clock is behind me, and having served in Parliament, I know it's a danger to go over the time. I want to start by thanking the committee for accepting to hear from me again on the issues of the Magnitsky bill and the sanctions in general.