Agriculture committee  You are absolutely right. Reasonableness is one of the areas that we are focused on in terms of opportunities to enhance the code. Our perspective is that, if we can modify it in a such a way that the necessary practices that allow the retailer—in our case, let's say this as an example—to hold manufacturers accountable remain in position and there are reasonableness thresholds that we can all agree to....

Agriculture committee  It's a bit complicated because that calculation is done on a 12-week average, not on an individual moment in time. In that context, 98% suggests that there's absolutely no room for error, whereas, in fact, there is. Remember that these are quantities that are agreed to up front.

Agriculture committee  The issue is the imbalance. Our view is that, if there's an expectation that a retailer enters into a set of detailed contract terms, a manufacturer should have the same responsibility. It's so that we all have the same piece of paper that says these are the terms we've agreed on and this is the basis on which we should conduct business.

Agriculture committee  As we've said before, the principles in the code, particularly around your point, which is how we improve the relationship between retailers and manufacturers, are absolutely sound. Our concern is that, in the drafting itself, it creates these vulnerabilities that create this risk.

Agriculture committee  It's an excellent question. I would say that we are a family business. Our family has been in this business for four generations, so we think about the long term as well. It's why we're so ambitious in our net-zero carbon targets. It's why I co-chair a global effort for the retailers in the manufacturing industry to find ways to reduce plastic waste across the industry.

Agriculture committee  Look, I absolutely think market-based solutions are an essential part of how to change economic behaviour and consumer behaviour over time. We're in a difficult spot because we're now trying to manage the cost of living against long-term incentives to change behaviour. I think we have to continue to work on ways to do both.

Agriculture committee  We certainly have. The introduction of the small-supplier program is probably the most public indication of that. The feedback we've received from small suppliers and manufacturers has been extremely positive, and we're continuing to look for ways to do that. We are in the midst of a review of our compliance charges to make sure that they are fair and justifiable, and this is how I know our fees are down nearly 50% this year.

Agriculture committee  I don't think I said that the front-of-pack labelling would cost $8 billion. I don't have a number for what that would cost. On the P2, it's $6 billion, and yes, all of these costs are cost pressures that are likely to end up being paid by consumers. I would just remind the committee again that the reason for that is that, if you have an increase on 80% in the cost of your business model and your profit is 2% or 3%, you are forced into a situation whereby you have to pass through a lot of these cost increases.

Agriculture committee  I believe so. Yes.

Agriculture committee  Loblaw, as I mentioned before, leads the way in plastic packaging reduction, and we work with a lot of manufacturers on innovation in this space. We think it will be very difficult to achieve the current timelines as laid out.

Agriculture committee  No, I don't believe it will.

Agriculture committee  I'll certainly take that away. It might very well be helpful to share some of that. I don't know where the $5-billion number comes from in terms of this. It's certainly not our number. As I've said before, in terms of our compliance charges, they are down substantially over the last couple of years.

Agriculture committee  Yes. We provided it before this committee six months ago. We've been fully supportive of what they've asked for and given them everything that we could.

Agriculture committee  We have data. They have data. Our data is pretty compelling on this front. We have laid it out in very specific terms. I don't believe that others have done it in quite the same way. We believe our data is right. It takes a bit of courage to stand in the way of something like this.

Agriculture committee  Food prices are the most important reason that we're here today, and I can tell you that Loblaw believes wholeheartedly in fair pay. We offer some of the most competitive wages in the industry. The fact remains that a large portion of our colleague base is part-time, and the reason it's part-time is that shoppers don't shop all the way throughout the day.