Canadian Heritage Committee on Jan. 30th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Catherine Tait]

We're very grateful. However, this year the advertising market in Quebec declined significantly. Hence the layoffs at TVA. It was quite serious.

In terms of our indicators for the current year, we're already forecasting a decline in advertising figures, especially in the French‑speaking market. That's the real situation this year.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Advertising salespeople won't meet their key performance indicator target and won't receive their bonuses.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you. We've gone over the time. I'm sorry, Mr. Berthold.

We're now going to the Liberals and Michael Coteau.

Michael, you have five minutes.

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Ms. Tait, for being here today.

I want to start by saying that like many people in the room, I think, I'm a big supporter of the CBC and the work you do. I have a lot of respect for people who work at the national broadcasting corporation and the work they do to share information, especially in an age of disinformation and a lot of challenges that are out there in getting information to people. I want to start off by saying that, because I think it's important. I see the value in the organization.

The challenge we have just as Canadians in general is that the world is changing, and we're going through a bit of a rough time from the economic downturn post-COVID. There are a lot of challenges out there. A lot of companies and certain sectors are being impacted in a very challenging way, especially your sector.

I know that you're in a unique situation. Sometimes you can compare yourself to the other broadcasters—I think you compared compensation, the work they do and things like that, and how they operate from that perspective—but you're also publicly funded, and sometimes you can't compare yourself to those organizations. It's a bit of a challenge being in that situation.

Tone is an important thing during these challenging times, and when Canadians see $16 million going out in bonuses, it's hard to stomach, especially when they see cuts. Usually bonuses happen when things are good, when the world is great and when the organization is feeling good. Things are good and we give out bonuses. That's what a bonus is: “Hey, things are good.” But things are not good. The $16 million represents, at roughly $75,000 a year, one-third of the jobs that are being cut—200 jobs. Two hundred jobs at $75,000 is about $16 million, so it's almost one-third of your problem if a job is on average at $75,000.

For us, it's hard to accept bonuses being paid when things are challenging. I know you said that this is the board of directors and they have a set of criteria they use, but you're the CEO. You can make a recommendation at any given moment to the board of directors. Would you consider asking the board of directors to reconsider the bonus structure at CBC?

[Catherine Tait]

I certainly will consider all scenarios; however, we have a program in place. First of all, these are not frivolous awards given at Christmas. This is performance pay.

For an individual, let's say, who's making $80,000, a portion of that pay is held back. That's what performance pay is. This is not an additional amount. We have a contract, and we contract with them for that $80,000. Let's say $7,000 of it is held back until the end of the year. If they perform and if the corporation performs, they get 100% of it. If we don't meet our objectives, they get less. That's why in the middle of the year to make a decision like that would be—

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

I'm sorry. I apologize for cutting you off, but the time is so limited. It's a challenge for us here in committee.

I understand that, and it does sound reasonable from a perspective when you may be making a certain amount at the lower end. Would you maybe consider those who are above the $200,000 mark? Would you consider maybe recommending a change in structure?

I know, for example, that at the top tier you can get a bonus of, I think it's 28%, at about $120,000. Would you consider maybe looking at those who make over $200,000 and setting a tone that Canadians could look at and say, “You know what? We agree with that; that's a reasonable approach”? Would you consider, as a CEO, going back to the board of directors and saying, “Maybe we should consider a shift this year while things are not as good as they possibly could be”?

[Catherine Tait]

As I said in my opening remarks, we have a process in place. We will respect the process, and to your question—

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

I understand that. I'm asking you, would you actually think about changing that process?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Catherine Tait]

—and I've said publicly that everything is on the table.

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Is the answer yes, you would consider that?

[Catherine Tait]

Everything is on the table. At the end of the year—

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

That means, yes, you will consider it?

[Catherine Tait]

—we will consider all our options. Yes.

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Okay, and I appreciate that. I think Canadians are looking for—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 17 seconds, Michael.

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Yes. I have a few seconds, right?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Yes, you have 17 seconds.

[Michael Coteau, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

I think Canadians are just looking for a signal that we're willing to work with the tone of the nation at this point. That's all.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much.

Now I will go to Martin Champoux from the Bloc for two and a half minutes.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair. Two and a half minutes fly by.

I'll address the latest response received when I told Ms. Tait that cuts of this magnitude would make it difficult for the Crown corporation to fulfill its mandate in Quebec and in French‑speaking communities outside Quebec.

Ms. Meloul responded that some programs currently on air simply wouldn't be renewed. This does nothing to reassure people in French‑speaking communities across the country, including Quebeckers, who care about their television and programs. I'm worried about variety programs. Of course, I'm also worried, especially given the current situation, about regional news. It's being compromised. We see radio stations struggling. We see newspapers, especially weekly newspapers, struggling. We see daily newspapers stopping print editions. The media industry and journalism industry are in danger.

When Ms. Meloul tells me—in good faith, I'm sure—that some programs simply won't be renewed, surely this means that other things may go down the drain. That isn't reassuring.

What Quebeckers want to hear, what would reassure them, is the recognition that Radio‑Canada and the CBC operate differently and must be treated independently of each other when it comes to these kinds of decisions.

I'm not saying that the French‑language services should be completely spared in the current situation. Of course, the whole industry must adapt. The public broadcaster's mandate will certainly be reviewed in the near future. At that point, its funding method, for example, will be looked at.

In any case, we must know now how you plan to reassure Quebeckers about the future of their television and the regional French‑language coverage provided by Radio‑Canada's news services. We haven't heard anything reassuring to address concerns and confirm that you understand the difference, the specificity of Quebec and the vital role of the Crown corporation, of Radio‑Canada, in this environment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

I'll let you respond, Ms. Tait.

[Catherine Tait]

Could I ask Ms. Meloul to elaborate on her earlier response?