The point of order is that it was a good number of the presenters who actually tried to sell this issue on the basis that they would then play a role in opening up credit to a whole lot of groups who now do not have credit or may be poor credit risks. It was not committee members who raised that point; it was the witnesses who made that point. And that is what has provoked some of the concerns that committee members are raising now.
So let's just be clear in terms of who's mixing apples and oranges.