Government Operations Committee on June 16th, 2009

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Excuse me, Mr. Chair...

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

Sorry, I'm on a point of order, Monsieur Roy.

The 48-hour rule governs a motion that's put forward, but if the committee moves to take up a matter of business, in the face of there not being 48 hours' notice, it's free to do it. It is free to do it as a committee, and this committee just a few minutes ago voted to entertain a motion.

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Oak Ridges—Markham, ON]

So then it's safe to say--sorry, because I know you're very good on procedure--

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

No, I've tried to answer your point of order.

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Oak Ridges—Markham, ON]

It's on the point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

I have another member who has a point of order.

[Paul Calandra, Conservative, Oak Ridges—Markham, ON]

Okay, and then we'll go to another one after. No, that's fine, we'll go to Monsieur Roy's point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

This may or may not set a precedent. I don't think it does--chair rulings don't.

Monsieur Roy, on a point of order.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Mr. Chair, you did not have to respond to that intervention because we were debating the motion and not the procedure. We have to get back to the debate on the motion. If there is no debate on the motion, once again, I call the question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

The chair agrees with that.

Is there any further debate on Ms. Hall Findlay's motion?

[An hon. member]

Mr. Chairman--

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

I have Mr. Brown with a hand signal.

[An hon. member]

Fair enough.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

I want a clarification, too, for future reference. Is changing the date--

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

We're debating the motion, not the procedure.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

No, it is, actually. It's in regard to your motion. Is that your ruling?

I didn't interrupt you, Martha, so I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't interrupt me when I make a brief comment.

Is changing the date considered substantially different so that...? It's the exact same motion except for changing the date, just so we know.

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

With respect, two-thirds of the motion was deleted, so it is materially different. In fact, those two were deleted because it was done at the request of Mr. Warkentin. This is a materially different motion from the one originally proposed.

Monsieur Roy has pointed out that the issue now is that the motion is there and it is to be debated, Mr. Chair. This has all been voted on. It would be helpful if we could actually now debate the motion itself.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

Okay. The question is not whether it's materially different--is it different--the motion is different. No one is arguing that it is the same motion as the one adopted two days ago, or the one that was disposed of earlier in the meeting. It's a different motion.

So, now, is there any further debate?

Mr. Anders.

[Rob Anders, Conservative, Calgary West, AB]

I'm wondering, I felt that your response to Mr. Calandra was questionable with regard to whether or not you're setting a precedent.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

A point of order.

That has nothing to do with it. We are discussing the substance of the motion now, not the procedure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

We're certainly debating the motion. Monsieur Roy is correct, and Mr. Anders says he wants to debate it.

[Rob Anders, Conservative, Calgary West, AB]

Mr. Chairman, I'm not sure that was an accurate or fair description or ruling on your part, and I'm wondering whether Mr. Calandra would like a vote to challenge the chair with regard to his explanation or findings on that.

[Jean-Yves Roy, Bloc, Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

That is procedure, Mr. Chair. I am sorry, we cannot go back to procedure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Derek Lee]

Mr. Anders has the floor on debate. Carry on.

[Rob Anders, Conservative, Calgary West, AB]

I'm trying to figure out whether Mr. Calandra would like to have a vote on the challenge of the chair part of that.