Government Operations Committee on Nov. 3rd, 2009

[Simon Kennedy]

It would probably be a direct marketing firm that would be engaged for that, but I would have to get back to the committee with the details.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you.

[Simon Kennedy]

With regard to the website, as the honourable member said, it's absolutely true that there are elements of the site that were not compliant with the common look and feel standard. That relates primarily to the technology being used for the site, such as Google Maps.

We had been working for some time with the Treasury Board to get an exemption from those elements of the common look and feel standards. If you're using new technology or if there's some facet to the website that may not be compliant, there's a procedure to seek an exemption, and we did obtain that. So we are compliant with the exemption in place.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

It's sort of like Animal Farm. No, I'm sorry, that's a cheap shot.

[Simon Kennedy]

On your third question, I think the secretary was going to respond.

[Michelle d'Auray]

With regard to what we prefer to call ceremonial cheques, the usage of them is covered only when a member of Parliament or parliamentarian is acting specifically on behalf of a minister as his or her designate. In that instance, it is an official Government of Canada activity where the department of that minister or the organization of that minister is supporting the member of Parliament or the parliamentarian in that event. We don't exercise an oversight over those events or initiatives that would have been organized by the parliamentarian's own volition or accord.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I don't have any way of proving this, but I don't imagine these guys all orchestrated these events on their own volition. They were doing a task for the government, which was to hand a very welcome and much appreciated cheque to people in their constituencies. Shouldn't that fall under the auspices of the Treasury Board guidelines? Where do you draw the line?

Again, any one of my colleagues here could produce their own cheque, I suppose, and go to where there's an excavation being dug and take credit for it. I can understand how that would be above and beyond Treasury Board guidelines, but it seems that when you call the media out--

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Mr. Martin, wrap up, please. Thank you.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I'm still not clear on how 50 or 60 of these people did that without any oversight from the Treasury Board guidelines, Madam d'Auray.

[Michelle d'Auray]

Again, Madam Chair, if these events were not organized or set out by the minister or by his or her delegates, the department would have not been involved in the event or the initiative, at which point the federal identity program and the communications policy would not have applied.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

We'll now go to Mr. Warkentin for five minutes.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Peace River, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate it.

Many good questions have been asked and we appreciate your answers this afternoon.

Congratulations, Mr. Wouters, on your appointment. You've been to the committee many times before. As usual, you don't disappoint, but this is the first time in your new capacity, so we appreciate your willingness to come here this afternoon.

There's been a number of things talked about around the table today. I just thought it was interesting, and perhaps it's a point of interest to members of Parliament who sit at the table here, that some concern was brought up by my colleague Martha Hall Findlay as it relates to the cost of the GO Train advertising that was undertaken to advertise the action plan.

I think it's of interest to members of the committee that in fact this is probably good value for money. I wasn't aware of what it cost to advertise in the Toronto Star, but apparently for a two-day ad it costs some $57,000 for half a page. I think that most of us in our capacities as members of Parliament have advertised either in election campaigns or at different times and do understand that advertising in newspapers is quite expensive and is not always the most effective way.

I would commend the folks who spent $46,000 to advertise with the GO Trains by wrapping those GO Trains, because not only has that run for 10 weeks, but in addition to that, they effectively received several full-page ads in earned media.

I'm just curious to hear if there is any Treasury Board policy related to innovative advertising where it involves the possibility of or a strategy that may result in earned media in addition to the expenditure that the government may have had taking place. Is there any concern or anything that would discourage the government from purchasing media that may lead to earned media as a result of that advertising?

[Michelle d'Auray]

Madam Chair, on the communications policy, the only elements that would guide certain activities would be ones where, for example, there would be partnership arrangements or events or initiatives where more than one partner would be involved, at which point there are some specific elements with regard to signage and credit, if I can put it that way.

In terms of subsequent media coverage, if I can put it that way, no, there are no elements that are in the policy in relation to that.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Peace River, AB]

I studied some marketing in my education and we were taught that, if you can get some earned media in addition to purchased media, that was always good value for money. I think this is a demonstration of where the government has clearly been wise in terms of the expenditure on this particular initiative. I think we'd all agree that there's been a fair bit of attention and a lot of people have noticed, even outside of Toronto, through the earned media that resulted from the decision to advertise in this way. I think we as a committee can commend the folks who came up with that.

I know there's some discussion as to the amount that has been spent in advertising the action plan. In my own community there are people who are unaware of the provisions under the home renovation tax credit. From time to time I have people contacting my office saying they heard from so-and-so just recently that this program exists. So there are still people learning about it for the first time, so we need to continue the effort.

There are also other provisions within the action plan that Canadians need to take up. They're things that Canadians actually have to act on, not things that are simply provided to them. And there are still Canadians who are unaware of that.

I'm wondering if the Treasury Board has any policy as it relates to polling to see how many Canadians are aware of certain provisions of government services and how that relates to advertising policies.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

You can answer.

[Michelle d'Auray]

Thank you, Madam Chair. I will be brief. I want to avoid your hand signal.

The communications policy does in fact have some elements with regard to the polling, the public opinion research. In fact, we do have to test prior to the advertising in order for us to be able to measure and monitor whether or not the advertising has generated what our objectives were.

For example, as Mr. Wouters mentioned, when we run a set of advertisements with regard to the home renovation tax credit, it's trying to get a sense of how many people know about it beforehand and then trying to get a sense of how many people know about it afterwards. It's the same thing when we run advertising for a particular campaign around emergency preparedness, for example. How many Canadians would know what they should prepare for or stock in the case of an emergency? We then run some tests afterwards to get a sense of whether or not the advertising was effective, or whether or not there has been take-up of a 1-800 number, a service, or a specific program or initiative.

Any advertising campaign, I believe it's over $400,000 or $1 million—

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Can you wrap up, please? I have a few members who really want to ask questions.

[Michelle d'Auray]

Over a certain dollar amount, there is a requirement to do polling before and after.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

Ms. Foote, you have five minutes.

[Judy Foote, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to pick up on what Ms. d'Auray was just talking about.

I'm wondering if it's possible for you to table the objectives of the economic action plan and the polling data that you just referenced as well, for the benefit of the committee.

[Simon Kennedy]

I believe that is possible. We'll have to compile the material because it's not a single document. There's a number of studies in different departments. We can get back to the committee with that.

[Judy Foote, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Would two weeks suffice?

[Simon Kennedy]

For the research that has been done, I think that sounds fine.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.