Evidence of meeting #18 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was gillani.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:40 p.m.
Bloc
Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC
Yes.
Please submit to us all the bilingual documents.
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Thank you very much.
Just back on that, when you met with him you were anticipating access to government funds. You were told about a $5 million fund. You subsequently got an e-mail saying that this fund was going to be--
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
I had said to him that in the case of our business we needed $5 million--not talking about terms or anything like that, just the quantum of dollars we were looking for. And he responded saying that the amount wasn't the problem; it was a question of whether we fit the requirements of the funding. So frankly, when I left from that lunch I didn't think we were going to fit a green fund, in the sense of the words--
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
My business partner shot off a message to Mr. Gillani saying thank you, and hope we did him justice, and the next day he responded, saying that we--
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
In your opening statement you actually said that after you heard that Mr. Jaffer had been in trouble with the law and had been arrested, it wasn't hopeful for government business after this incident. What did you mean by that?
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
Given the nature of what had come out in the media at that point in time, my assumption, which proved to be a false assumption, based on subsequent communications from Mr. Gillani, was that he was going to distance himself from anything to do with Mr. Jaffer until his affairs were sorted.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
And there were subsequent e-mails from Mr. Gillani saying--
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
The one on October 16, that he was still engaged with Monsieur Glémaud and Mr. Jaffer.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Okay, and you waited for this term sheet, in other words.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Based on the fact that you, in your mind, thought you were going to get a great $5 million, low-interest loan, how did you think you were going to remunerate Mr. Jaffer for this access?
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
We had an agreement with Mr. Gillani on his finder's fees. I don't know how the funds were going to have flowed to Mr. Jaffer, but we were expecting a 10% finder's fee, which amortized over a five-year term would probably have been something we could still service, even at 2.4% interest on top of that.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
I think Mr. Snowdy is a shareholder, or was a shareholder, in your company.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
He was not a shareholder. But you did hire him as a private investigator.
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
He is a long-time friend, about 20 years or so, of one of my business partners. He looked into the affairs of our business before I even really knew about it. He was concerned about Mr. Gillani and what he was potentially setting us up for.
I first had an engagement with Mr. Snowdy in about June or July. We didn't pay him anything. I mean, I didn't... I picked up a lunch or two here or there, but we didn't have a contract and an investigation agreement with him or anything.
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
I understand that he had to ask your permission before he disclosed information he had to the Conservative lawyer. Is that correct?
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
And to the authorities.
Can you describe what information he was submitting?
4:45 p.m.
As an Individual
There is an element of it where... I tried to keep a little bit of distance between anything he had that didn't pertain to our business and anything outside of our business affairs.
This whole talk about cellphone shots and busty hookers and all this kind of stuff that has made its way into the media wasn't something that concerned me as far as our business goes. If they were elements that he had discovered during the course of his investigation, then I gave him permission to go ahead and use his discretion to provide whatever he needed to, to Conservatives, Liberal Party, whoever else needed it.
