Evidence of meeting #44 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was hollander.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
That's correct.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
Okay.
It was just a retirement; he was not told that his time was up?
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
No, he was not told to leave. He announced his retirement in January of 2010. It was a planned retirement after a long career.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
We'll see.
Unless I am mistaken, you stated that you cannot investigate. You are aware of what is going on, you know that the RCMP is doing an investigation on LM Sauvé's famous contract, but you are not involved in that at the present time. Is that it?
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
That's correct.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
Does that also mean that, because you are in an acting position, you are unable to deal with that matter?
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
That's correct. I'm exercising the powers of the deputy procurement ombudsman to ensure the continuity in the office, but I cannot exercise the powers of the procurement ombudsman that derive from the legislation.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
If I am employed by the government and I do not want to see this file dealt with, that means that you are going to have a pretty good interim job for a good while. That means that, as long as you are in this acting position, no one, at your level, will be able to deal with this matter.
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
I have been informed that an appointment will be made shortly, so this should no longer be an issue for the office.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
Yes, but you are aware that in the government, when people say "shortly", that can take some time. You have a month, you have a date...
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
Imminently.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
You have the month, you have the date, but you do not have the year, is that it?
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A member
In 2014.
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The hon. Denis Coderre
In 2014?
9:35 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
Let me rephrase that. It's imminent. The appointment is imminent.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
That could be done, because it was done for the auditor general.
Procurement is not just an issue of construction; it's also the issue of national defence or IT or.... There are several issues, and I've asked the Auditor General to look at defence procurement because I think there are a lot of flaws there.
But regarding that, if I as a member of Parliament am saying to you that we believe you should take a look at that--because, as Mr. Hollander said, we might have a lot of questions to ask, and if the RCMP is there, it would be appropriate that the ombudsman would have to take a look at that--can I do that, or you cannot do anything as interim?
9:40 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
As interim, I cannot launch a review of construction procurement practices. We can start to gather the information, we can start to do some research, but I have no authority to launch a practice review on this matter.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
I would like you to do one. In light of all that we have seen since the beginning, I am requesting this of you officially, on behalf of the official opposition — and if others wish to join me, be my guests. I believe it would be appropriate to do so. If only for that reason — and we are pleased that you are here today —, I would ask you to launch such a review. Must I write you a letter or await the imminence of the appointment of the next ombudsman?
9:40 a.m.
Deputy Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
Well, you can certainly send our office a letter, and we will do what we can in the interim.
Upon the appointment of the new procurement ombudsman, in my capacity as deputy I would brief on what's happened and brief on your request, and then it would be up to that person to exercise his or her authority to launch a practice review under the legislation.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Denis Coderre Liberal Bourassa, QC
In that case, we will be sending you a letter.
Mr. Hollander, the issue regarding LM Sauvé is that it seems it had been changed three times before we provided the contract. You said you can play with those contracts; it doesn't have to be at the top level, but at the junior level you can make some changes.
How would you react if you had that kind of information, that we changed the contract three times? Do you see the possibility of certain fraud that could happen there?