Evidence of meeting #118 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was contracts.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Alexander Jeglic  Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman
Derek Mersereau  Director, Inquiries, Quality Assurance and Risk Management, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

11 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley

Good morning, everyone. I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 118 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates, also known, of course, as the mighty OGGO.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(3)(c) and the motion adopted by the committee on Wednesday, January 18, 2023, the committee is resuming its study on federal government consulting contracts awarded to McKinsey & Company.

We have new instructions, colleagues, regarding the feedback for our interpreters, so please listen carefully.

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These measures are in place so that we can conduct our business without interruption and protect the health and safety of all participants, especially our valued interpreters, who are smiling at us but also threatening and menacing if we don't follow the rules.

Thanks, everyone, for your co-operation.

We'll start with our witness, our very valued procurement ombudsman.

Welcome back to OGGO. We appreciate you coming in on relatively short notice and we look forward to hearing from you.

11 a.m.

Alexander Jeglic Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Thank you.

I'd like to begin by acknowledging that the land on which we gather is the traditional unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.

Thank you, Mr. Chair and members of the committee, for inviting me here today.

My name is Alex Jeglic and I appreciate the opportunity to appear again before this committee to shed a light on the findings of my office’s recent report on procurement practices of contracts awarded to McKinsey & Company.

With me today is Derek Mersereau, director of inquiries, quality assurance and risk management.

My office is independent of other federal organizations, including Public Services and Procurement Canada, or PSPC. I submit an annual report to the Minister of Public Services and Procurement, but the minister has no influence over the results of my reviews or reports, and all my activities are conducted at arm’s length from PSPC and other federal organizations.

As a neutral and independent organization, our legislative mandate includes the review of procurement practices of federal departments in order to assess fairness, openness, transparency and consistency with laws, policies and guidelines, which is what we're here to discuss today.

On February 3, 2023, the Minister of Public Services and Procurement requested that I conduct a review looking into contracts awarded to McKinsey & Company. Once my office was able to establish reasonable grounds as per our regulatory requirements, the review was launched on March 16, 2023. As per our legislated deadline, my office completed the review of McKinsey contracts on March 15, 2024, and the report was published on our website on April 15, 2024.

My office examined the procurement files of 32 McKinsey contracts and one national master standing offer, or NMSO, issued to McKinsey through competitive and non-competitive procurement processes in order to assess their fairness, openness, transparency and compliance with legislation, regulation, policy and procedural requirements. PSPC was the contracting department for 23 contracts and the national master standing offer. The review did not include contracts awarded by federal organizations that are not in my mandate, such as contracts awarded to McKinsey by Crown corporations.

With regard to competitive procurement practices leading to the awarding of contracts, my office identified instances where procurement strategies were changed to allow for McKinsey's participation in the procurement process, creating a perception of favouritism towards McKinsey. We also observed deficiencies related to bid evaluations in multiple files, including missing or incomplete documentation, failure to conduct evaluations as per the planned approach, and the inappropriate re-evaluation of bids, leading to McKinsey being deemed the only compliant bid.

My office also identified shortfalls related to personnel security clearances, including lack of documentation to show that the security clearances of proposed resources were verified before they were authorized to work, or to confirm that contracts were sent to PSPC's contract security program when required.

With regard to non-competitive procurement practices leading to the awarding of contracts, my review found that the sole-source justification used by PSPC to establish the McKinsey benchmarking services NMSO did not contain the required information needed to justify this sole-source standing offer. Nineteen contracts known as “call-ups” with a total value of almost $49 million were issued to McKinsey without competition against this standing offer. We also found that the vast majority of call-ups issued against the McKinsey benchmarking services NMSO were void of any description of the specific work to be carried out by McKinsey and, by extension, proper PSPC oversight.

In these files, there was no evidence that a statement of work had been developed in advance of determining the procurement strategy or contacting McKinsey with the requirement. In these cases, it was impossible for my office to determine the extent to which McKinsey defined the requirement for these departments, which is a serious threat to the fairness of the procurement process.

All call-ups issued against the McKinsey benchmarking services NMSO were non-competitive. The majority of these call-ups also lacked sole-source justifications. Sole-source justifications were never sought by PSPC in its capacity as the contracting department. In total, 18 of the 19 competitive call-ups were awarded by PSPC in the absence of justification on file.

We also noted conflicting information regarding the use of the McKinsey benchmarking services NMSO for call-ups with security requirements.

My office examined practices for issuing contract amendments and task authorizations for McKinsey. Overall, contract amendments were appropriate and in line with policy and guidelines, but several issues were noted, including an instance where the contract amendment was not on file, an instance where the contract amendment was not issued prior to contract expiry, and an instance where the call-up was amended to increase the value by nearly $2 million without a clear description of the changes to the scope of work.

We also examined practices related to the disclosure of contract awards. In most instances, necessary disclosures were made on the proactive disclosure website. However, we noted issues with respect to the accuracy of information.

In total, there were five recommendations made by my office, which were all accepted by the implicated departments. It should also be noted that PSPC accepted most of the findings in the report but took issue with some observations.

I would be pleased to discuss all of these matters with you.

Thank you for your attention.

I would be pleased to answer your questions.

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley

Thank you very much.

We'll start now with Mrs. Kusie for six minutes.

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much, Mr. Jeglic and Mr. Mersereau, for being with us here again today.

I see four lines of enquiry, the first one being “Competitive procurement practices leading to contracts awarded to McKinsey”. However, 78% of McKinsey contracts were sole-sourced and 59% of the contracts you reviewed were sole-sourced specifically under a benchmarking service deal catered towards McKinsey.

Is that correct?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

I can't validate the statistics, but yes, it sounds accurate.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Thank you.

This specific benchmarking solution was originally valued at $47 million, but then it increased to $48.8 million. Only one contract of the 19 provided any justification as to why McKinsey was the only company able to perform the necessary services. This means that $43 million was paid to McKinsey without the proper documentation. This is a theme we've seen repeatedly, unfortunately, across this government.

Do you believe it's because the departments favour McKinsey as a company in comparison to others that perform similar services?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

I think that in totality, we concluded that, in addition to the NMSO—which you well described—there were other instances of favouritism towards McKinsey.

The one counter to that is that in the NMSO creation, as we reported in the report, there were four other national master standing offers with other entities that were not McKinsey.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Why, do you think, were departments changing their requirements to allow for McKinsey to bid on contracts that it was not originally eligible for?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

Again, where there's a lack of documentation, we simply allege the facts. I don't know if you recall, but in my previous testimony, I started to talk about negative inferences. At what point do we make negative inferences associated with the lack of documentation?

This report starts that trend of negative inferences where we allege the facts, but we ultimately came to a conclusion that, in sum, there was favouritism toward McKinsey.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

What evidence did you find that encouraged this favouritism by government departments?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

You've cited two examples. One was in the change of procurement strategy. We saw that there was a procurement strategy being contemplated. It was only through the realization, whether that was directly with McKinsey or through the contracting authority, that they would not be qualified to participate in the process that, therefore, there was a reconsideration of the process.

Could there have been additional factors in addition to that fact alone? Absolutely. We're not discounting that. We're simply saying that it did happen and the contracts were in fact awarded to McKinsey.

I will just say one more thing. In addition, we found a lack of documentation. Other ways that we could kind of walk back our findings would be if we saw documentation that would explain why some of these decisions were taken. You'll note from the report that there was a lack of information explaining why there was a change of these decisions or procurement strategies.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

That's interesting. It's very similar to the Auditor General's findings around ArriveCAN in that she was unable to determine the actual cost of ArriveCAN as a result of missing documentation.

The only contract that received a justification was challenged by PSPC. I believe the term they used specifically was “take issue”. The words were “take issue” because it was not accurate and did not justify the exception.

Did ESDC respond with the proper justification or did they maintain their original justification?

11:10 a.m.

Derek Mersereau Director, Inquiries, Quality Assurance and Risk Management, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

The justification cited in the report is the only one we saw. We didn't see a subsequent one. That might have been previously adjusted, but what we saw in the file is what's reflected in the report. It provided inadequate justification, in our view.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Thank you.

To approve the contract, PSPC had the minister of procurement personally sign off on this $5.7-million contract.

Is that correct?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Which minister signed off on this contract?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Thank you.

Is it standard practice for a minister to personally approve a contract that their own officials challenge?

11:10 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

In this circumstance, we did look for the rationale as to why the minister signed off on this specific contract. I believe there is an internal delegation instrument within the department that, based on the dollar value associated with the contract, required minister approval.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

What justification would a minister possibly use to sign off on a $5.7-million contract?

Can you think of a justification that would be legitimate, where a minister could personally override their officials and sign off on a contract?

Have you seen this before? If yes, when? If not, what kind of justification could possibly be used for this type of authority?

11:15 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

I will say that the implication of any political actor in a procurement process is not ideal because it puts the political actor in a difficult position, whether it's the approval or rejection of the recommendation to ultimately enter into the contract.

That being said, the signature was provided based on the recommendation. It was in line with the required delegations within the department.

Beyond that, we have no additional insight as to specifically why that was done, other than the value of the contract.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Stephanie Kusie Conservative Calgary Midnapore, AB

Thank you, Mr. Jeglic.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley

Thank you very much, both of you.

I have Ms. Atwin for six minutes.

Go ahead, please.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

Jenica Atwin Liberal Fredericton, NB

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to our witness for being with us.

I'm new to this conversation and I have a lot of background questions, so please forgive me.

I'd like to start with the task and solutions professional services. TSPS consists of two supply arrangements, one for task-based requirements and the other for solution-based requirements.

Can you please explain the difference between the two?

11:15 a.m.

Procurement Ombudsman, Office of the Procurement Ombudsman

Alexander Jeglic

Sure.

As you mentioned, they're both supply arrangements, and both of them are eligible for use. They're mandatory tools. The distinction between the two is ultimately in how the deliverables are stated in the statement of work. For the task-based, that's very deliverables focused, so typically there's a lot of precision associated with the scope of work. In the solutions-based, you're identifying a problem. Therefore, the contractor has much more leeway in terms of how they deliver the solution but they are, ultimately, accountable for delivering the solution. That's the predominant difference between the two.