Evidence of meeting #32 for Health in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was regulations.
A recording is available from Parliament.
December 7th, 2006 / 4:40 p.m.
Liberal
Tina Keeper Liberal Churchill, MB
I would like to thank the panellists for their presentation today, because I have very limited knowledge about this area as well.
My question is about the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, the guidelines that were developed for embryonic research, and what kind of impact the regulations will have on those guidelines.
4:40 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
The CIHR guidelines predate the statute and predate, obviously, the regulations. CIHR takes very seriously its role and obligation to be subject to the law, and at present the guidelines are in compliance with the law. This is the advice we've had from Justice Canada.
This is the way things stand now. If the statute or the regulations change in a way that is inconsistent with the guidelines, of course, the guidelines will change. It's not the tail wagging the dog; the statute speaks.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
CIHR is doing embryonic stem cell research now, I understand. Is that true?
4:45 p.m.
Dr. Pierre Chartrand
Yes.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
Since we're talking about consent, what consent practice are you using on those embryos?
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
CIHR established a research ethics board, an REB, the Stem Cell Oversight Committee, to ensure the research the agency funds complies with the guidelines. Within the guidelines are a number of criteria for consent. The Stem Cell Oversight Committee makes sure that consent forms and the whole protocol conform with these ethics guidelines.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
Are they just frozen embryos, or are you using fresh embryos in the research?
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
The Stem Cell Oversight Committee has considered protocols involving frozen and non-frozen.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
The embryos you're using now, do you know whether they were from frozen or from consent and fresh embryos?
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
There are a few things here. CIHR, the Stem Cell Oversight Committee, has considered protocols—
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
I'm not interested in protocols; I'm just wondering if you're using one or the other.
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
Yes.
CIHR is not doing the research. The research is being done out there by researchers. Not only that, but the Stem Cell Oversight Committee—
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
Yes, but do you know? You've set up the protocols. You don't know?
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
I'm sorry. Could I ask you to reframe the question?
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
The answer is no.
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
Correct.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
4:45 p.m.
Liberal
Robert Thibault Liberal West Nova, NS
To clarify that same question, I understood the CIHR protocol was that surplus embryos could be used, but embryos could not be created for research. If a researcher applies and is using surplus embryos, whether or not they are frozen wouldn't be in the qualification criteria for that research funding. The question was that the embryos could not be created for the purpose of that research.
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
That's correct.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
Describe to me, for clarification for the committee, how you would have an embryo that is not frozen, that is created and used for the purpose of stem cell research. How could that take place?
4:45 p.m.
Director, Ethics Office, Canadian Institutes of Health Research
That's a good—
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
How could it not be frozen? When an embryo is created, it's for the purpose of reproduction. When it's placed into a womb, we don't know whether it's going to work or not until the next cycle. The leftover ones have to be stored until we know.