It depends. We provide loans. We do get returns, but we're not seeking returns. IAF at MaRS is like a venture capital fund, but again, social capital.... In Ontario, for example, there are also the Ontario emerging technologies fund and OVCF, the Ontario venture capital fund. They are more like a regular source of funds. They provide funds to other venture capital companies. They also co-invest. FedDev does co-investing with angel funders.
The key is not so much for the government to try to get into the venture capital business in the sense of displacing private sector venture capital. The key is for government to get in and de-risk the opportunities. As Ilse was saying, there are certain elements that are just not viable by themselves, but government can get in and de-risk. It can make the equation look better and attract more private sector funding to that particular area for investment.