Health Committee on May 6th, 2014

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

If I understand correctly, we have a small sample of three out of fourteen young adults. If we compare the three young adults to the others who didn't smoke marijuana in the previous year, we see that smoking marijuana one to four times a year does not have a negative effect, based on the fact that their results were similar to those of the rest of the control group.

[Dr. Andra Smith]

That's correct.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

That's rather interesting, especially since a number of witnesses and Conservative members are trying to point out that it's harmful to a person's health to smoke marijuana, even if it's just a few times a year.

The study showed that the three young adults who smoke marijuana one to four times a year had the same results as the eleven others with respect to brain activity. I find that very interesting. Thank you.

I was talking about prefrontal activity. There are obviously a number of things that can increase brain activity. I don't know all of the substances, which is why I want to get your opinion.

If a person consumes a large quantity of sugar or caffeine shortly before undergoing an MRI, can it affect brain activity?

[Dr. Andra Smith]

We did try to control for that. Yes, caffeine can affect the brain activity. Both groups had the same amount of caffeine intake and with the same times from use to imaging, so that was controlled for. I don't know about sugar. I don't know about that.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Okay. I also saw that—

Is my time up, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Ben Lobb]

Yes.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

I'll ask my other questions later.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ben Lobb]

Mr. Lizon.

[Wladyslaw Lizon, Conservative, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Thank you to all the witnesses for being here with us this morning.

I have two questions. They are kind of general, and I hope I have enough time to ask them.

In different parts of the world it's customary to smoke naturally grown cannabis or marijuana. In some parts of the world they smoke opium. In other parts, alcohol is a substance people use. Is there a study that would confirm that in comparison to those who didn't use marijuana, the effects on IQ, effects on learning are prevalent? You know what parts of the world people naturally would use marijuana, and not in other parts. Has anybody ever done a study to confirm there is an effect on IQ, on learning, on the achievements of young people?

[Dr. Kevin Sabet]

If you look at the country regions, you would need to control for multiple different factors within that society, so the study done in New Zealand is the exact study you're talking about. That is where they were able to control for all of the different things, and basically had identical people, half of whom used, half who didn't, and compared those groups when controlling for other things. I think that New Zealand study is really the study you're referring to.

If you were simply to look at a part of the world that has higher cannabis use, let's say Canadian youth versus youth in India or youth in China, you would have to be controlling for so many things it would be almost an impossible research design. You need a much more natural group to look at, where you can control and fix things, and that would have been the New Zealand study.

[Wladyslaw Lizon, Conservative, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Thank you.

There is a lot of suggestion we should educate young people. Education is something that has been done for years on the danger of using alcohol and tobacco. I don't think we have been successful. Therefore, what methods would you suggest should be implemented on educating young people and adults on the danger of using cannabis?

[Michel Perron]

If I might, I will lead off the response.

The one thing we'd say is on the alcohol side, we have seen some success if you look at drinking and driving patterns and behaviour there. There has been a significant change in how society responds and engages in that, and there's been a significant decrease. It's similar around tobacco consumption. There's been an important decrease in the consumption of tobacco.

We know what doesn't work, and that is scare tactics and things that really amplify the risk beyond the pale. Young people don't associate that with the reality they see on a regular basis.

We do what works well in terms of prevention messaging. That is to provide them with the facts. Young people are very astute and they want to know what in fact are the impacts.

Young people are concerned about their brain development. I think the opportunity for going forward around prevention is around the brain and talking about how that is their own asset and how it is that the impact of cannabis or alcohol affects that. I think it's about providing real facts in terms of the impact as we've heard today. These are not skewed. This is very generalized conclusive evidence that I think people would take on board and say, “Does this make me any better in what I need to do?” It's also about having societal understanding around the issue that cannabis is not a benign substance. Cannabis is not good for you and cannabis doesn't necessarily help you in terms of scholastic outcome and certainly not as a young person.

That dialogue is not occurring in Canada today. Rather, it's about a much more political discussion around how we should treat cannabis. That tends to confuse a young person. Thinking of the U.S., in Colorado and Washington, all of those schemes there apply to those 21 years of age and over. The vast majority of people who consume cannabis in Canada are under 21. The majority start at around 14 or 15 years. They peak at around 15, and taper off at 24. This is an issue of a young person's consumption.

I think it's about focusing on real facts, about empowering young people to make informed decisions, having the right kind of prevention programs in schools and communities and ensuring that they have the same message, and ensuring that parents can be supported in providing the same kind of messaging as well, because they're not hearing that. In fact, I think they're very much underestimating the risks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ben Lobb]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Lizon, your time is up.

[Wladyslaw Lizon, Conservative, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Really?

[The Chair, Conservative, Ben Lobb]

Yes, sir.

Mr. Morin, you're up again, sir. You have five minutes.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

I want to continue with Dr. Smith.

Thank you for answering my questions. There's a lot of information I'd like to get about this study.

As part of this study, you ensured that each of these 24 young adults was not using illegal drugs, but were some of them taking medication prescribed by a doctor?

[Dr. Andra Smith]

No. None of them were using any kind of prescription medication.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Okay, good, because for some people, the histamine release could have had an effect on the brain.

The Government of Canada launched a medical marijuana program. Do you think the government had the scientific evidence it needed to launch this program a few years ago?

[Dr. Andra Smith]

Just to clarify, are you asking whether the government, in putting in this program, based it on scientific evidence? Do they have the scientific evidence?

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

When they launched this medical marijuana program, did they have the scientific evidence that would support launching such a government program?

[Dr. Andra Smith]

That's a tough question.

I'm not sure that the scientific evidence was there at the time. I think we have it now that marijuana is dangerous. Again, I think we really need to separate medical marijuana from the use that is going on in youth. I think they are very different situations.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

You just said that marijuana use is dangerous, but you did note earlier that the three kids who smoked marijuana, one to four times in previous years, did not show any difference from the other nine kids in the control group.

Can you still say that marijuana use is dangerous, period, or is it high exposure to marijuana?

[Dr. Andra Smith]

The groups that we had were smoking more than one joint a week. That's what I can say—

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Yes, I know. And I mostly agree with you that heavy use cannot be good for health, whether we are talking about alcohol or smoking tobacco.

I do wonder, is there some kind of study? As a scientist are you aware of any studies of kids or adults smoking small amounts of marijuana throughout a whole year? I don't know, maybe those four kids have parties with their friends and they smoke only one to four times per year—

[Dr. Andra Smith]

Let me just interrupt. They had no THC in their urine. Their urine samples were negative. They had no THC in their bodies at all.