Human Resources Committee on May 30th, 2023

[Bonita Zarrillo, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

It just kind of rolls into the social innovation fund a bit. There are quite a few organizations in my community that work on food recovery and on food security. There are huge logistics involved in that and, really, a lot of skills and a lot of opportunity there.

Do you see a space for that in your social innovation fund? How can folks like NGOs in my community get involved in that work?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

It's a great question.

As I was mentioning, yesterday we announced the three fund managers who are going to be working through that: CAP Finance for Quebec, and Boann Social Impact and Realize Capital Partners in the rest of Canada. They are just getting set up right now, but they will be launching a web portal as well, where social purpose organizations, whether they be the not-for-profit sector, charitable organizations or social enterprises, can get more information.

We also have the investment readiness program, which is run through about 20 different partners across the country. For example, Community Foundations of Canada is one of them. They have helped support over 1,100 not-for-profit and charitable organizations in getting ready to apply for investments, some of which are food security organizations that are doing really tremendous work when it comes to food recovery and reducing food waste.

Absolutely, there is huge potential here. What I am particularly excited about, with regard to this new social finance fund, is that it's a vote of confidence from the Government of Canada, and it will hopefully attract other private investors to see that they too can make investments that have a social impact and that do a social good in our country.

[Bonita Zarrillo, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Thank you. Any information you can share with this committee that we can send out to our community groups would be great.

I want to just revisit with both Minister Qualtrough and Minister O'Regan around the labour shortage study that came out of this committee with a focus on the care economy, which is really where I want to go, because I see some discrimination that happens in the heavily gendered work that is the care economy.

One of the recommendations out of that care economy study was that we needed to collect more data, more market data, on what's happening in the care economy. If I think about post-COVID, if I think about aging, and if I think about the health impacts of climate change, this is timely, and we have an opportunity to get ahead of it.

I know that there is an intersection between labour and employment, so I wonder if you could maybe give us an update on what kinds of conversations are happening around collecting data. What channels are you collecting data on? Are women finally getting priority in the labour force in Canada?

[Carla Qualtrough, Liberal, Delta, BC]

I know that our department has been working very closely with StatsCan to beef up and disaggregate the data we're collecting from the labour market survey to really dig in on the kinds of questions you're talking about. We have all this high-level information, but it doesn't, in some cases, tell us the real story of what's going on in a particular sector. I'd say the care economy is right there with it, so we really need to understand the intersectional aspects of who's working where, their gender and race and whether or not they have a disability.

Cliff, are you our labour market survey guy? I can't remember who...?

Okay, they're not here.

[Jean-François Tremblay]

It's the labour market survey, but it's not just that. It's also even our work with provinces, for example, through the LMTAs, trying to make sure that we have information that is more targeted and more precise on who benefits from the funding.

Most of our programs now have criteria that make sure that we address gaps in diversity, which means that in situations, for example, with the care economy, there would be groups that are under-represented. How do we make sure they're being addressed?

We see in terms of results that it's very positive.

[Bonita Zarrillo, NDP, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

One of the things, too, that I wanted to raise is unpaid care. The number of hours that go into this from caregivers is becoming a really heavy burden on them, both physically and emotionally. Even the cost of goods and care.... Is that something that's also part of that study?

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

I'll just add briefly to this to say that in conversations we have with SEIU members, many of us around this table have probably come into contact with members of the care economy, particularly if we have aging parents. You see first-hand the amount of work they do, so it became very clear how underpaid they were, and un-resourced in many instances. It became very clear to us during COVID how they work multiple jobs in multiple locations. For a whole host of reasons, there were other issues there.

We're working with them on a host of issues, but if you ask them, they will tell you that their top priority is ratios. They want to be able to provide better care. After they get paid for value for what they do, they also want to be able to provide better care for their patients.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Ms. Zarrillo.

I have a clarification before we move to the next round. We began at 4:12, and we have resources to go to 6:00, committee members. It's my intention to schedule the full first hour for the ministerial appearances, so that will bring us to about 5:12. It's my understanding that Minister O'Regan has to leave around 5:00-ish, so...

[Carla Qualtrough, Liberal, Delta, BC]

I apologize, Chair; I have a flight to catch as well. I have to leave at 5:00 as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Okay, so it will be three getting the last 12 minutes, then. With that clarification, Madam Ferreri can begin the second round for five minutes.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the ministers for being here today to answer some questions.

A new passport design was unveiled on May 10, and we have Minister Gould quoted as saying, “I think a couple of the questions have been suggesting that there's a partisan aspect to this,” and, “I think it's important to say that this is not partisan. The design of this passport started 10 years ago and this is really about ensuring the security of the document.”

I'm hoping the minister can table for this committee where in the 10-year consultation there was a desire to remove the imagery of Terry Fox, Canadian athlete, humanitarian and cancer-research activist, the Battle of Vimy Ridge, the Fathers of Confederation, the last spike being nailed into the Canadian National Railway and Nellie McClung, a member of the Famous Five. Could you table that with the committee?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

You will have to ask Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, because it's an IRCC initiative.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you for that.

You were at the launch. Are you not able to table this to the committee at all?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

I wasn't involved in the design process. It's an IRCC initiative.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Okay.

I'm curious, then, if you would be able to answer how much money was spent on the consultation on the redesign for the passport.

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

I cannot, because it was IRCC that did this.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I guess, then, I would ask you if you're comfortable or happy with the imagery that was removed.

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

Well, I think that every 10 years we have to update the Canadian passport. That's for security purposes. In fact, it's best practice internationally to do so at least every 10 years, if not more often, because we want to ensure that the Canadian travel document remains something that has the highest integrity. That's really important.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I'm sorry, Minister, I know we always get cut off in these things because we're so short of time. I have just a direct question. I understand that you have to redesign it. I understand that portion of it for sure.

Are you happy with what was removed from the passport?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

I think it's important to note that.... Well, I can actually answer the question the way I choose. Every 10 years we have to redesign the passport. It's important that it is completely redesigned, because we don't want to have anything that could be fraudulent. There was an extensive consultation with Canadians. That's my understanding.

If you have further questions on this, I'm sure the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada would be happy to respond to them.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you, Minister.

I think your lack of an answer and how you chose to answer that speaks volumes. A lot of people, like the Royal Canadian Legion, Brad West, who is the mayor of Port Coquitlam, and the Vimy Foundation press release will find your choice of answer interesting. I think it offended a lot of Canadians. I think that's what you've said today.

Moving on to—

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

Actually, I didn't say any of those things. Those are words you've put in my mouth. I think it's important to have that be clear on the record.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I didn't put any words in your mouth. If you're not able to answer any questions on the passport, that's fine.

I guess we could move on to Bill C-35, which is, for many people at home, the child care bill. There's been a lot in the media lately about what are called “child care deserts”. For example, 85% of Newfoundland and Labradorians do not have access to child care.

This is not a child care program. This is a marketing campaign for a lot of parents who are left in these deserts.

There was an amendment. The original wording in the amendment was, “the progress being made respecting that system, including information relating to the quality, availability, affordability, accessibility, and inclusiveness of early learning and child care programs and services and to the access to those programs and services”.

This is the wording of your bill, Minister. In committee, we saw an amendment put forward that removed the words of the key pillars, “availability” and “accessibility”. This is the number one thing we heard from witness testimony.

My question to you is, when did you and your office approve and support the amendment to remove the words “availability” and “accessibility” from the reporting of the progress of the program?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Burlington, ON]

My understanding is that it was because that was redundant in the clause that it was put in. It was already implied, and that's why it didn't move forward as such. It was repetitive.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I would definitely challenge you on that. It wasn't redundant at all. These are the pillars. This is ultimately the whole crux of this system. It's that there is no availability and there is no accessibility.