Evidence of meeting #11 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was designers.
A recording is available from Parliament.
10:20 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you.
You showed us a table that was more blue than it was red. However, the CRTC has ordered that 60% of the programming must be made up of Canadian content.
Can you explain why we see only American programs?
10:20 a.m.
National President, Alliance of Canadian Cinema, Television and Radio Artists (ACTRA)
They have not declared that yet.
10:20 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
The CRTC has asked broadcasters to include 35% of Canadian content in music that is aired. For television, Canadian content must be 60%. Looking at your schedule, there is no 60% Canadian content. This is in breach of the CRTC regulation.
How do you explain that?
10:20 a.m.
National President, Alliance of Canadian Cinema, Television and Radio Artists (ACTRA)
Thank you.
I believe CanWest Global will be listening very carefully to the CRTC's rules. It's a very important multi-billion-dollar decision that's happening right now.
We are continuing to advocate that there needs to be a minimum of content in prime time. Global and CTV, the big private broadcasters, are saying that they're putting money into priority programming—that means Canadian programming, which could be news, sports, or variety—and it's not necessarily in prime time. We need to see Canadian work in prime time, and we will be arguing about that until the cows come home.
10:25 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
All right.
Ms. Sannella, you are saying that we need to support designers. Are the people who work in the field of design self-employed?
10:25 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Design Exchange
It depends on the design sector. Graphic designers are mostly self-employed; I think about 62% to 63% of all graphic designers are self-employed. It's less for interior designers, less for architects. Industrial designers are mostly self-employed. The number of self-employed people depends upon which specific design sector we're looking at.
10:25 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
In your opinion, through which sector should the Canadian government provide grants to support these designers? What would the return on those grants be? I am trying to understand exactly what your interests are, so that I can promote them later on. I'd like to fully understand why we should provide greater support to designers, rather than publishers, who charge 15% more for their books, according to Mr. Tabor.
Could you please expand on that?
10:25 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Design Exchange
I believe that if the government is looking to stimulate the manufacturing economy and raise the current manufacturing up the value chain, then they have to subsidize industrial design and graphic design. That's a given.
I believe that the architecture, interior design, and landscape communities aren't part of that equation, so if the government's innovation initiative is to see how we can create more new products and compete in the international economy, then those two, specifically industrial and graphic, must be part of the equation and must be subsidized to help stimulate manufacturing and help them understand it's critical that this is part of the innovation equation.
10:25 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
You use products from the manufacturing sector to decorate and create. Do you believe that the manufacturing sector should be given higher subsidies to help it come out of the economic quagmire caused by the fluctuating dollar and Chinese exports?
You use prefabricated products that you showcase. There are therefore just as many designers who work for stores, and ones who specialize in interior design, or as there are freelance architects.
Shouldn't we provide greater support to the manufacturing sector so that you have what you need in terms of decoration?
10:25 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Design Exchange
Yes, that's what I'm trying to say. I wish I spoke French. Maybe one day.
Specifically, if we are trying to stimulate the manufacturing economy then we must subsidize industrial design and graphic design as part of the innovation equation. Design can be a direct driver of the manufacturing industry rather than the other way around.
Maybe if you're producing furnishings, in that equation you include interior designers. Maybe if you're producing automobiles you need to include more industrial designers and maybe a combination of designers to produce better interiors for cars.
You could include other types of designers, but I believe, at a minimum, it should include some kind of subsidy or credit for using designers, maybe of any type, but specifically for industrial design and graphic design purposes in the innovation equation.
10:25 a.m.
Bloc
Robert Vincent Bloc Shefford, QC
Could I use some of the 30 seconds that remained earlier to speak for another minute?
10:25 a.m.
Conservative
10:30 a.m.
Independent
André Arthur Independent Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Thank you, sir.
My first point will be to go along the same lines as Mr. Simard when he talked about income averaging. Income averaging is a necessity in any equitable fiscal system, especially for people who are creators, who live in insecurity over the years. You've got one good year, three bad years, fat cows, lean cows, and it touches on people in professional sports, artists, actors, and anybody self-employed who can have a bad year.
The day that we come back to the system we formerly had in Canada and that was removed, we'll have made a significant step toward fiscal justice. I don't know how this committee can contribute to this, but let's talk about it at one time or another.
Mr. Simard, your second point concerned the quality of the Quebec cultural industry.
For English Canada, this has taken on mythical proportions. Quebec culture, and Quebec producers, have an advantage that the rest of the world only dreams of: a captive audience. The more we allow the teaching of English to erode, the more barriers we build around Quebec preventing people from learning what goes on elsewhere, and prevent people from travelling freely across provincial and national borders.
More and more Quebeckers are being forced to consume artistic products of declining quality, and put up with a cultural class that is becoming increasingly incestuous.
I must be said that within Quebec's film industry, auditions are virtually never held to seek out real talent, but the friends of those involved in subsidized productions are simply brought in. Auditions are never held within the Quebec film industry, or at least almost never. We see more and more subsidized artists driving around in Mercedes that the average person would never be able to afford.
An increasingly select group is being generously subsidized. You can't begin to imagine the number of extraordinarily stupid programs being served up to Quebeckers by private and state television in Quebec, because the captive audience can't look elsewhere.
Mr. Hardacre, the mandating of Canadian content has always been a given in Canadian cultural policy. Is that because you don't trust the Canadian public to support and listen to quality when they see it, or they are too dumb to recognize it when they see it, or is it because you don't trust yourself to produce things of quality that the public will recognize and support? How come you always need the big brother of government to force you on the Canadian public?
10:30 a.m.
Conservative
10:30 a.m.
National President, Alliance of Canadian Cinema, Television and Radio Artists (ACTRA)
I find this a very good way to get my adrenalin going.
Monsieur Arthur, merci. That's a very fine question to challenge me with.
As an organization of performers, we do not expect the government to be a big brother. We would not want that. We are talking about our culture. We're talking about cultural identity. We are dealing with, unfortunately, neither.
You gave me two options: is the public not smart enough, or is our quality of work too low? There is another option, and it is what's in force right now.
Television is the breeding ground for filmmaking in all countries. Particularly in English-language countries, television is the breeding ground for filmmaking. Television is inundated in this country. The private broadcasters are inundated with American programming, and it's not an accident. It is because the product is dumped into this country, dumped because the private broadcasters can buy it cheaper than they could buy an hour of Canadian programming, because the American production has all its money made already south of the border.
So it virtually is dumped into Canada, and the private broadcasters then have simulcast rights, which allow them to sell advertising at high premiums. The revenue from advertising is very high because they get the spinoff from the programs being in the exact same time slot as it is in the border cities. It's called simulcasting. They have that protection, which is really not free market at all, and they are benefiting from it. Yes, we believe broadcasters should make money, but we do not want to see them only make money with Canadians having no choice to see English-language programming in prime time.
10:35 a.m.
Independent
André Arthur Independent Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mrs. Dayus, you told us that the price of books was fixed by other people, publishers, and that—
10:35 a.m.
Independent
10:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Booksellers Association
The price that is printed on the book is established.
10:35 a.m.
Independent
André Arthur Independent Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Yes, and that it's established long in advance of the time of sale.
