Industry Committee on Nov. 29th, 2012

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

My final question, which you may not have the answer to, is in the same area. One of the targets is to increase “the amount of investment in research and development by Ontario businesses”, which I completely agree with. You have a base here of a target of $279 million, and I guess that's in 2002 dollars. What kind of increase is that? Is that a 5% increase? A 4% increase? It doesn't tell me that. The other target has a number of people, which is easy to measure. I don't know what that means, that $279 million in southern Ontario. Is that a lot more...?

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Very briefly, please.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I'm not aware of the actual percentage change from 2002, but we can get back to you with that answer, if that's okay.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Thank you very much, Minister.

Thank you very much, Mr. Wallace.

Mr. Stewart, for seven minutes.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for coming today.

I have a larger budget question, although it's related to the supplementary estimates. I'd like you to situate these estimates in a larger context. According to the latest StatsCan bulletin, “Federal science and technology spending for fiscal year 2012/2013 is anticipated to decline 5.9% from 2011/2012...”. When adjusted for inflation and shown in real dollars, we are looking at something like an 8% cut. Do you dispute this assessment?

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I can tell you that our government has invested more in science and technology, in real dollars, than any government in the history of this country. That includes an $8 billion increase in new funding, as you would know. Some of that funding, as I mentioned earlier to our other colleague—$200 million for IRAP, the industrial research program—was a short-term, temporary stimulus funding.

Overall, I would say to you that science and technology has been strongly committed to by this budget. The numbers—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

But do you dispute the finding by Statistics Canada that we're cutting 5.9%—and, in real terms, about 8%—from last year's budget?

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

Well, I dispute your interpretation that we're cutting. I'd be happy to—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

It's a reduction in funds.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I would have to take a look at the Statistics Canada form that you're looking at—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

But you should know it, because you are the minister of state for this.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

Well, I'm telling you—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

I'm sure you've seen it.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I haven't seen the Statistics Canada—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

You don't know that there's a 5.9% cut to your budget.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

There is not a 5% cut to my budget.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

It is 5.9%, according to StatsCan. But you're unaware—

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

According to budget 2102, which you voted against, there were 35 million additional dollars, $35.7 million—

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Yes, but it's a simple question. If your overall budget.... Statistics Canada is saying that your S and T budget is reduced by 5.9%. It's a very simple question: is this something you dispute or do you acknowledge that this is the case?

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I'll have to look at the document.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

But you don't know now? You've come before us to talk about budgets and you don't know your overall budget—

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

I'm trying to answer the question as I do know it. That is, since 2006 we've added $8 billion in new dollars to the science and tech sector, and you voted against all of it.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Is it that you just won't admit there's—

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

No, you're asking me to comment on a piece of paper that I've already acknowledged I haven't seen.

[Kennedy Stewart, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

You haven't seen the Statistics Canada report that talks about your—