International Trade Committee on Feb. 15th, 2024

[Doug Forsyth]

I don't know about topping, but certainly, I think we have an opportunity to increase our exports. Again, just to go over what I said, where we stand to benefit the most is where we pay the most duty, and that's certainly on goods like wheat and lentils.

As my colleague mentioned earlier, it's not the only place that we will benefit. As you noted, Alberta and Saskatchewan—and Manitoba with respect to oats—do produce a lot of those products.

However, some of the industrial products that will benefit from FTAs include machinery parts, helicopters, plastics, iron and steel. Those are produced in various provinces, and I'm not sure exactly which ones would benefit the most, but certainly, beyond Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba is where we see a lot of industrial production.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Could liquefied natural gas, or LNG, potentially be developed later?

[Doug Forsyth]

That's a good question. I'm not aware of all the measures in place for the export of LNG. You have to be able to process it to transport it. There are no pipelines between Canada and Ecuador. So it would have to be transported by ships.

I'm not aware of a plant in place that would be able to transform that liquid natural gas into a transportable subject. They may be working on it, but I'm not aware of it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Sheehan, go ahead for five minutes, please.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

The trade commissioner service has identified some opportunities that match with Canadian capabilities and local demand, and you've touched on quite a few of them, the extractive industry and agriculture as well.

They have identified some others, and I'm interested in this, because Sault Ste. Marie is the self-declared alternative energy capital of North America. We don't say alternative energy; we say light clean tech or green technology. They have identified clean technology as an opportunity. What kind of opportunities in clean technology would they be talking about?

[Dean Foster]

I think what I would say is that Ecuador currently maintains an average tariff rate of 17% on non-agricultural goods. They have broad tariff coverage inside their profile. When you think about a long-term trade relationship, this FTA will provide for competitive opportunities in any sector.

We don't have a particular clean tech stakeholder group that has stepped forward, but I would say that, over a long time horizon, you can imagine this as being a facilitative agreement in any services or goods trade commercial sector.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

It just seems to me that a lot of countries are interested in our technology around small nuclear reactors and things of that nature, where they can be deployed in areas that are hard to get at, if you will. Whether it's up north in Canada or Japan, there's a real interest in that.

Will there be opportunities for that particular industry to participate in the analysis of the opportunities?

[Dean Foster]

Reactors haven't come up as a particular interest, but I would come back to my previous comments and indicate that, where demand arises in the commercial relationship, this free trade agreement would support and facilitate expanding trade on a competitive basis.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

The trade commissioner service also talks about infrastructure opportunities. Could you describe what those look like? What are the opportunities, and what are the benefits to Canada and, for that matter, the country we're trading with, Ecuador?

[Dean Foster]

Sure. To put it in terms of the architecture of the agreement, the trade in goods provisions and the elimination of customs duties on all non-agricultural products are what we're going to be looking for, so that would facilitate the trade in goods.

The services and temporary entry for businesspersons provisions that we will seek would provide for the liberalization and market access commitments on non-discrimination in those areas and facilitate the ability for highly skilled professionals to move more easily between the two. There's a bit of a value chain aspect to putting together the various provisions of the agreement, but broad sectoral benefits are what we would anticipate within the scale of the relationship.

[Doug Forsyth]

If I could just add to that as well, speaking about infrastructure, government procurement is the other piece of that. I think that's another important chapter for us, broad-based but certainly within this FTA, to make sure that there are meaningful market access commitments and reciprocal opportunities on both sides here.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

As well, we're talking about opportunities to improve environmental co-operation. I was thinking of the agreement that Canada signed with the Ecuadorean government recently, and this is in particular to eradicate the dark vessels that are around the Galapagos Islands. Can you make comments on that and on what kind of co-operation that helps to foster in your negotiations?

[Dean Foster]

I would describe that agreement as one of the many potential supporting agreements or mechanisms that we have outside of the free trade agreement negotiation itself. That would be mutually supportive with the environment chapter that we would plan to negotiate and the co-operation activities that we would undertake under that environment chapter. As in the case of any trading partner with which we have a free trade agreement, we usually have many other bilateral agreements of various natures. The dark vessel agreement would be one of those mutually supportive types of treaties alongside a free trade agreement if we were to conclude negotiations and implement it.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

I think that is extremely important, because Ecuador has a new president, who seems to be progressive. I'm very hopeful that we can continue to work together to improve this planet, because overfishing, especially in the Galapagos Islands and other very sensitive marine areas, can really set off a domino effect of terrible things. I just wanted to point that out, because there are some good indicators of some advancement. I pointed to the agreements that were signed in May 2023 around gender. There was another one around trade in general, an agreement to try to improve everyone's lives. Could you make a comment about that one? It is the Inclusive Trade Action Group.

[Dean Foster]

Indeed, that is another example of mutually supporting agreements. In that case it is a plurilateral type of initiative, co-operative in nature but not in any way in conflict with a bilateral free trade agreement. Rather it is complementary to it. With regard to the dark vessel agreement, we will pass on to our environmental negotiators your interest in the matter of ocean environmental issues, which they are watching right now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

To committee members, we have completed three rounds. We have a few minutes. Does anyone have a pressing question for our departmental officials that won't take too long?

Mr. Cannings, go ahead.

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

I would just like to ask someone to expand on this issue of ISDS being unconstitutional in Ecuador and where that stands.

[Reuben East]

We've had discussions about what the court has said and so on and so forth, but I'm really not in a position to comment on the constitution of Ecuador. I'm certainly not an expert on that. If Ecuador has considerations to share in that regard, we'll look to discuss those at a negotiating table for sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Mr. Savard-Tremblay, go ahead.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Two days ago, we heard from Amnesty International representatives. They asked us not to approve an agreement that would have been reached without the participation of indigenous peoples, including indigenous women and their organizations, which are quite active.

Is there any measure or any process to guarantee consultation and transparency with Ecuador's indigenous populations? In other words, are we setting conditions for Ecuador as well?

[Doug Forsyth]

I can comment only on what we have in Canada. We do have an indigenous working group that we consult with throughout our FTA process, and we will continue to do that.

I understood the question about Ecuador.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Sometimes, during negotiations, especially if there are concerns about human rights, we can set conditions and subject the negotiations and signature to assurances that everything is being done properly and transparently on the other side.

[Dean Foster]

In that regard, we will be engaging with our Ecuadorean colleagues to compare notes on our respective domestic approaches. I would just add that we also have supporting programming right now to make a positive impact on the development of free, prior and informed consent laws of Ecuador. We have a team going down next week, and I'm very heartened by such a supportive initiative.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

I'm very happy to hear that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Mr. Arya, you have a minute.