Evidence of meeting #39 for Justice and Human Rights in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was murder.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

John Giokas  Counsel, Criminal Law Policy Section, Department of Justice
Bruce MacGregor  Director of Law, Military Justice Policy and Research, Department of National Defence
Myles Kirvan  Deputy Minister of Justice and Deputy Attorney General of Canada, Department of Justice

5:15 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

--the minister himself referred to other bills. The parliamentary secretary and another member of the Conservative Party referred specifically to Bill S-6 and continued many questions on it. Therefore, I think my points are not at all inappropriate. They're in direct relation to statements that the minister himself has made here.

Now, I have a question. It's about your response on Bill S-6 and the issue of, if I can use your exact words, the terror and horror that families of victims relive over and over again when convicted multiple murderers apply for the faint hope clause every two years, or every two years from the previous application and refusal.

Would you be able to provide this committee with a reason why your members would have voted against an amendment to Bill S-6 that would have required a mandatory notification to the relatives of victims when an offender did not apply for early parole under the faint hope clause and, under the new legislation, would not be eligible again for five years?

That notification would also give the family of those victims a notification that the offender did not apply under the deadline and that the next earliest opportunity would not be until x date five years hence, in order specifically to allow those relatives to live a certain amount of time without that stress, without that anxiety that you so well and accurately described.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

First of all, as just a slight correction in what you said, the faint hope clause is not available for people convicted of multiple murders.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

I understand that.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

It's one murder.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Yes, I understand that. I may have misspoken.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

I'll tell you my problem with your amendments. To be fair, I guess you were quite honest. You said you wanted to keep the door open for some possible future government that you might be a part of and that you would like to reintroduce that. I read your comments. You said, “We'll be honest”. That's fine. That's your business to do that. But here's the effect of this. If you change the name of the bill and you change the number of days, it has the effect of holding up the bill.

On the one hand, you started off by saying, “Doesn't the government want to get these things passed?” Yes, I want to get them passed. If you keep amending them, if it goes back to the Senate and you have some of your colleagues down there make an amendment because they want a small change on it, the thing will never get passed.

I'm trying to get these pieces of legislation through. I'd like to get them into the law of this country before Christmas, but if I get four or five amendments.... On the one hand, you can tell people that you're supportive of it, but that you have a lot of amendments, that we need a lot of studying of these things.... It's very difficult, you know, Madam Jennings--

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Minister, could you--

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

Thank you.

We're going to go to Monsieur Lemay.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

On a point of order, I would just like to point out that the minister did not address the specific question about the notification to the relatives of victims of murder.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

Hold on. First of all, that's not a point of order.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

That was not answered, and I would like, through the chair--

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

You're already well over six minutes.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

No, but I would like, through the chair, a request to the minister to provide--

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

We want to make sure everyone gets a chance to ask questions--

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

--his answer in writing.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

--because we do have votes coming up.

Monsieur Lemay.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Chair, this is a point of order.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

It is not a point of order.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Chair--

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

Is it a procedural matter?

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

It is a procedural matter.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

All right. What is that procedural matter?

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

It is a procedural matter. I have the privilege of asking the question.

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Fast

Yes, you do.

5:20 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

The minister did not respond to the specific question. I'm therefore asking that you, as chair, ask the minister to provide his response to the specific question that I asked about the amendment requiring a mandatory notification to the relatives of victims of murder--