A very short question.
Evidence of meeting #34 for National Defence in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was norad.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #34 for National Defence in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was norad.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
NDP
Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL
We have a navy, of course, and we keep sending ships abroad into the Caribbean and for piracy interdiction.
Do we need a navy to defend Canadians' largest coastline in the world?
5 p.m.
Fellow, Canadian Defence and Foreign Affairs Institute
Do we need a navy? Is that the question?
5 p.m.
NDP
Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL
We seem to have lots of ships to send elsewhere, and we're busy trying to build more to keep up our fleet. Is that still important for Canada?
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Peter Kent
Thank you very much.
We'll go to the Conservatives now.
Mr. Norlock, I understand you're sharing your time with Mr. Bezan.
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Peter Kent
It's the other way around.
Mr. Bezan, you're sharing your time with Mr. Norlock, for five minutes.
5 p.m.
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake, MB
I have just one question for General Macdonald.
We had talked earlier about reductions in defence spending. Canada is not immune to what happened in the recession of 2009, and the United States and some of our NATO allies were really hit hard. One of the greatest speeches I have ever heard from a foreign dignitary in the House of Commons was by Australia's former prime minister John Howard, who said that the world without a powerful United States is a very scary world indeed.
How do you see the huge defence cuts that we've seen in the United States? We hear about complete fleets that are sitting in dock unable to move because of defence cuts, and a major reduction in the number of forces they have currently in the service. I want to find out if you're thinking that this affects not only North American peace, defence, and security, but also what's happening on a global scale.
5:05 p.m.
LGen George Macdonald
Certainly the United States is losing some capability. I think you have to look at it in the longer term, because the capability they've developed or deployed for Iraq and Afghanistan has been pretty active over the last decade. Sequestration in the United States has taken its toll.
That said, the United States still possesses a military capability that far exceeds that of any other nation on earth. Perhaps we should be more concerned about China and Russia growing not just in very incremental terms, but growing dramatically, in double-digit growth rates year over year, in their military capability. Even though it's still a long way from what the Americans have, it still has to be a concern about balance of power.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake, MB
As a follow-up to that before I turn this over to Mr. Norlock, for that Russian buildup in particular, most of that has been going into their naval bases and military buildup in the Arctic, has it not?
5:05 p.m.
LGen George Macdonald
I'm not sure that I could competently say that. Certainly there has been a lot of strategic aviation investment and investment in cruise missiles and ballistic missiles, but I think we should be concerned overall.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
5:05 p.m.
LGen George Macdonald
Yes.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Thank you very much.
I'm assuming I have about a minute and a half, so I'll make this—
5:05 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Wonderful.
My friend here is a former member of the military, both in Canada and in eastern Europe. Before the Ukrainian issue appeared, my friend kept telling us to keep our eye on Russia. After you gentlemen were talking about the Russians and their intent and how it's not something we need to worry about as a threat, my friend said to me, “That's exactly what they want us to think.”
If you take a look at some of the things that Mr. Putin has said concerning Ukraine, that they were withdrawing their tanks and sort of heading east again when they were actually going in the opposite direction, and I could go on and on, you can see that he does the opposite of what he says.
My challenge to you is, how can you say it's not a threat when he is beginning to exercise his muscle? There are those of us who think that just by his actions in eastern Europe, and we know why...maybe he has designs—and I believe he does, because I'm beginning to believe my friend here—to be something of the old.... You know how powerful Russia was in the old Soviet regime. Maybe there is some reason to worry. Maybe we should approach Russia with more caution than we do and not be lulled into thinking they're not a threat.
Tell me how wrong I am and why I'm wrong.
5:05 p.m.
LGen George Macdonald
I don't disagree with you. In fact, I think my answer to Mr. Bezan suggested that we should be concerned about Russia.
5:05 p.m.
LGen George Macdonald
We can also take some solace, perhaps, in the fact that I'm not sure the Russian economy can sustain Mr. Putin's grandiose ideas about his future, but that shouldn't dissuade us from paying very close attention to it and not trusting him.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Mr. Bow will probably tell me that there is a country, which you just mentioned, that does have a growing economy and does have a capacity to build a military far superior than, I would suggest, Russia and perhaps the United States put together. Mr. Bow, could you comment on China's ability to grow their military and become a bigger threat?